The problem with you spill is you hit the rear brake....
You should have done the rear brake lock up demo in your MSF class and you should have felt how it is.. Not very confortable... And its not... You should be pulling on your front brakes HARD (not to the point they lock but almost) and use your rear brake to blance everything out. Some guys might lock there rear for fun on a Harley but thats comes down the road.
But i dont know about the whole weight vs bikes weight.. I dont think it was a major fact in you going down.. But test ride a sporty and feel how it is and you make your own mind on it.
Edit:
I did re-read and notice you said uphill on lose gravel.. At that point, you still want to use your front brakes more.. but you want to watch out for locking the front.. Its lose gravel and its easy for anyone to go down in that.

 

I agree with the previous statement...grabbing the rear brake will almost always guarentee you will go down...or at least the back end will slide from under you. As for size making a difference, I have seen all kinds of people of lots of different sizes riding anything from an XR50 to an Ultra Classic. The bike you ride needs to feel comfortable to you and only you can decide what bike that will be. Sit on and try to test ride different bikes to find the one you feel the most comfortable on.

 

I think for your weight vs bike size
youshoud look at the max weight allowed with a passenger. That is listed on a bikes manual. I don't know what it is off the top of my head but for example say a typical rider weighs 200. and his passenger weighs at around 130. you got a combined weight of 330. On a sporty I think the max weight is around 400, maybe 450. So you are good. you just might not want to carry a passenger, and if you want to carry one then I am sure there is a rear "heavy duty" shock out there that you can use (but that last part I am just pulling out my butt, I don't know if one exists).

hope that helps.

BTD

BTW did you get my PM?

 

I'm a big guy myself at 300 lbs and I wouldn't look good on a moped, or a crotch rocket. Hell, I probably don't even look good on my Deuce either.

 

I would say you crashed and burned because of your skill level of riding, you said learner bike, gravel, and rear brake. To me it adds up to locking up the rear brake on dirt, kicks out the rear end and you were not ready for that, and down you went.

Now have some friend buy you a BELL for your crash.

 

Um, 315 lbs. on a Sportster? Not a good combination. Think circus clowns on small bicycles. Go with the Dyna.

 

i am going to have to disagree with some of the statements made here. you were on gravel. it can be unpredictable. a hard stab at the front brake may very well have washed out the front wheel and sent you across the front of the bike side ways and head first. a rear wheel skid can be controlled (cmon...i know a lot of us grew up on dirt bikes and did it for fun) it just isnt an effective way to stop. i am not advocating using the rear brake as opposed to the front...only that in a panic situation in a non-controlled environment the stuff you learn in a parking lot might or might not help. i have personally controlled rear wheel lock up on mulitple bikes at speeds over 60 mph and i am sure there are others here who have done the same.
as long as you arent overloading the bike youre on there shouldnt be a size problem. are you comfortable? cramped?
maybe what you need is just some time in a lot practicing your limits so you are more familiar with how the bike handles in different situations.
now you are one of the riders who has been down. welcome to the club. the others will be here soon.

 

Tom's post, as usual, makes great sense. Either brake or both will easily lock up and wash out on gravel. There are few worse surfaces. I'm grateful that I spent a lot of time on dirt bikes and learned what bikes will and won't do without too many injuries to show for it.

MSF would have helped with the skills/knowledge needed in this and other situations that will bite us in the butt if we do the wrong things.

T113

 

I'm 190lbs and a little under 6 foot tall. With some minor adjustments, my Sporty ended up fitting me just fine. However, the bike is really under a load with a passenger (combined weight of around 330lbs).

So how a bike feels to you is very important, it may not seem so at first because you are a new rider. But overtime you will start to notice comfort and power type things. Also, if you plan to ride passengers (after the cycle course - of course) then that is a consideration that you must also make.

But overall, be it with a boat or bike. People (inlcuding me) tend to start small and work their way up.

So, no for a short time that 440 maybe just fine for you. But you are not a small boy and that is not a big bike! So, overtime I think you will not be satisfied with the ride, power and comfort level.

Regarding the rear brake - just like the other guys said, take the course. Search and read the responses on this forum of other bikers who took the course, almost everyone was very glad they did.

 

Don't even go there with the Sporty. There is a guy I've seen around town who is probably your weight and rides an old school Honda 250, the one lunger, with a roundish tank and chrome front fender - looks like a 1975ish model. The guys looks pretty funny on that thing. In your case, I don't know if your overweight or just big and tall. This guy is overweight - there's a lot of man and little bike. If you're tall, then go with something like a Road King (it has a higher center of gravity and seat than a lot of harleys) but if your over weight, then definitely get a bike with a lower seat, like a Dyna or even a Springer Softail. By the way, I agree with the threads here: All harleys are easy to ride with the right skill level. A Road King isn't any harder to ride than a Sporty once the skill level is there. I'm about 5-9 and a buck 65 and road a Road King for the last 4 years, just recently bought a Deuce this month.

 

Um, 315 lbs. on a Sportster? Not a good combination. Think circus clowns on small bicycles. Go with the Dyna.

What the WideOne said... what TomV said... what Trooper said.

What I say... Go Dyna!!

 

I am a big guy to 360+, awhile back I rode a buddys sporty first time I had been on one in many years and I felt like Hoss Cartwright on a Shetland pony. I say dyna althe way unless you can swing a big FL for the same money even if you have to go with a used bike. Police RoadKings can be had for a good price if you look around. Just my heavy .02c. Thom

 

Practice practice practice. If you dumped a 400lb bike in loose gravel, you surely would have done the same on a 700+ lb FLH. It ain't the bike - I have an old CB350F that hauls my 240lbs well enough and it handles just fine too. On that note, if I bungee my briefcase on the seat it's probably at max capacity. The main benefit of a heavier cycle is highway performance. If you just scoot around town it's no big deal. If you're limited on budget you're better off buying a big metric for now instead of a sportster (unless you really want one). Ride that a while and save your pennies for what you really want.

 

Anyone can wash out on gravel during a panic stop. Next time, just slow down without locking anything and hit the dog if you have to. Don't swerve!
I used to know a guy who ran 280 and had a Sportster 20 some years ago. With drag pipes and some jettting he could outrun the young punks on what passed for crotch rockets back then. Of course, he was an experienced rider, and he made sure to avoid top end runs. Only you can tell if the smaller bike bothers you. Buy what feels right.

 

The problem with you spill is you hit the rear brake....
You should have done the rear brake lock up demo in your MSF class and you should have felt how it is.. Not very confortable... And its not... You should be pulling on your front brakes HARD (not to the point they lock but almost) and use your rear brake to blance everything out.

I was just doing as I was told my my step-father. He's been riding bikes since he was 12 or so, rode Harleys until just before he met my family, including a chopper with a springer front and hardtail, he was even in a rather notorious motorcycle gang in the area. So, I listened to him when he said "get in the habbit of using the rear brake, if you get in serious trouble, you don't wanna hit the front brake, best to use rear, then front." I was just doing as I was told, and I have done a rear brake lock up demo and recovered without a hitch, on pavement. This was gravel. Irregardless of all of that, I seem to have lost the point of my whole question in telling that story.

 

At your size a Sporty would be to uncomfortable for you to ride.

Sure you can ride any size bike that you can lift a leg over -- that don't mean you will be comfortable though.

I am jazzed up right now and feeling good -- just got out of the shower and stepped on the scales. One year ago today I was 235 lbs -- today I weighed in at 191 lbs!!!!!!

 

70% of your braking power is in the front brake. You can recover from locking the front wheel by releasing it and regrabbing it without locking it. Release a locked back wheel and you run the chance of a highside.

 

I've seen 6'3" and 250# guys riding YSR50's on the track for race days - even for an endurance race of 2-3 hours. Comfy? probably not. Point is that experience has far more to do with any ride than some magic body to bike weight ratio.

Pick the ride that feels best to you, whether it be a Sporty, Dyna, RK, or something else. With enough practice, you will be able to ride and properly handle any bike.

BTW, I know the gravel feeling quite well - hit some at low speed in a corner over the weekend - didn't even have time to get any brakes! Only scratched a little bit on the turn signal and scratch up the front fender some, but no damn fun!

Also, used to own an '84 KZ1100. Great older bikes and the 440 is a great beginner bike. Check out www.kzrider.com for a great forum on the old Kawi's.

 

I'm thinking that putting much more than 325#'s on a Sporty might result in having to have it surgically removed. LOL

 

I'm in agreement with what tomv said earlier. I've watched several guys dump bikes using the front brake in dirt and gravel. I've locked the rear brake up I don't know how many times on dirt bikes and a few times on the street and I've always been able to recover. But on dry pavement it's best to use your front brake as much as you can as that's where most of your traction will be due to weight transfer.

 

Gravel is nasty stuff. It will trick you whether you are braking or accelerating. I was crossing some recently applied shoulder gravel coming out of a driveway onto the paved highway. It was very deep and soft though it didn't look that way at first. I tried to come out at a perfect 90 degree angle to the pavement and then clear both tires. Turns out I didn't fully clear the rear tire and when I started to apply throttle and make my turn the rear spun and then hit pavement and almost high sided me out into the other lane of the highway! Scared the crap out of me. I hate gravel!

 

Wolf - Just to back up Zuhaib - the front brake is your best friend and you really need to learn how to use it. In the bad old days perhaps front brakes were more grabby - and this legend of 'don't touch the front brake' was covered in the MSF class I took.

However I already was a front brake user as I used to race dirt bikes -- and the only way you can keep the juice on for a second or two longer heading into a curve -- is to be able to brake like hell and bleed off speed at the last moment(s). Therefore you need to agressively use both brakes.

So I agree with many others that it was the gravel that really caused the problem coupled with your experience level. I would also say the tires and the frame geometry were not on your side either - its one thing to go tooling along on gravel on a dirt bike with knobbies + real shocks -- and quite another on a road bike.

Something else that was brought up in a thread about deer - and that is if you're really close and need to do something -- aim for their ass as they will probably scoot out of the way instictivly at the last second - dog should do the same

 

Again....I know what I did wrong already, you don't all have to repeat how bad of a rider I am, I already feel enough like an idiot. My question was about bike to rider weight ratio, if there is one, and if it'd be easier for a rider of my size to learn on a heaver sled. If we could please aim towards that answer, I'd apprecate it.

 

Again....I know what I did wrong already, you don't all have to repeat how bad of a rider I am, I already feel enough like an idiot. My question was about bike to rider weight ratio, if there is one, and if it'd be easier for a rider of my size to learn on a heaver sled. If we could please aim towards that answer, I'd apprecate it.

The answer is, I think, No. It is easier to learn on a lighter sled. You can concentrate more on learning basic skills than on trying to keep a heavy bike up. A lighter bike is more agile, more manouverable, more responsive, and easier to handle. It is less powerful so you are less likely to make some of the biggie mistakes like overpowering into a curve or worse into a declining radius curve. Plus you are a little less likely to get a speeding ticket... like I got the other day. :-(

 

I am sure either would work for around town. Bikes have a gross maximum weight and it is published. I have a Road King, so my GMVW will not help you, but I am sure you can find the GMVW of the bikes you are looking at. Take that, subtract the weight of a wet bike, and that is your payload capacity. Will you have two people at times, then the payload should exceed yours and their weight, plus your luggage. I think that is the technical answer to your weight ratio answer. I think that if it is just you, you will be fine on normal sized bikes and larger. Forget a vespa.

The second issue is seat, since smaller bikes have smaller seats. A consideration at least. Two people on a small bike can get crowded.