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OK, now this thread has been revived, will ATF of any variety work in the new Rushmore Limited primary with the wazzoo SE compensator?? Seems it's not the clutch pack that's of concern anymore but lubricity on the compensator ramps.
 

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^^ +1 for me. I just changed over to Mobil 1 Synthetic ATF in my '14 Street Glide before I heard it wasn't recommended. I've used it in several other bikes & didn't give it a second thought. I've only been able to ride about 20 miles since & didn't notice a problem but I'm "assuming" it's the long term effects that are a concern.
 

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running a Barnett Scorpion Clutch, found that Type F or B&M quick shift are the best fluids to use in my beast.
 

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Another Oil/ATF dilema/question

I noticed this thread was started in 2008. A lot has changed since then ( I did read through the entire post though from beginning to end). I think the engines have changed a lot since 2008, some by design, some by customer demand and some by EPA regulation.

My previous Harleys predated 2000, I now have a used 2011 Ultra Limited 103 with 11k miles. Still researching suitable lubricants but wanting to change out my fluids...Syn3 was placed in all 3 holes for the time being.

From all of this reading I surmise, a good quality ATF was generally OK to use in the primary, is this still the case with newer models? If I understand correctly ( I am strictly a touring kind of guy) since I don't push the engine/transmission to its limits, a good quality 20W-50 would suffice in my situation??:coffee:
 

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I used Ford Type F to flush out the old 10w-30 I had in there - It ran better and I had less issues shifting my old tired 5 speed. When I got home the bike refused to shift gears and find neutral from 1st.

I cleaned out that with another Ford Type F bottle, and the same thing happened. Great clutch action except for one time the clutch wouldn't disengage all the way to let me shift all of a sudden at a random time. Slowed the engine and the bike down and problem went away and didn't come back.

Got Dexron VI full synthetic and put that in there, and let me tell you. Not ONE problem. Tensioners aren't wearing any more or less, I've had no clutch disengagement issues no matter what I've done, ambient riding temperatures from 65-85*F, hauling ass 80/85 on the freeway or driving around town.

Definitely not going back to multiviscosity oils from the store.
 

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Had to pull primary apart to look for rattle, clunk everything looked great .Buttoned it back up and relized I had no more Redline primary fluid. So I dropped some MERCON V in so I could road test it ,70 miles later I think I'll stay with it each shift is a click ,neutral is easy and seems to pull 10 times better.!drunk!
 

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Had to pull primary apart to look for rattle, clunk everything looked great .Buttoned it back up and relized I had no more Redline primary fluid. So I dropped some MERCON V in so I could road test it ,70 miles later I think I'll stay with it each shift is a click ,neutral is easy and seems to pull 10 times better.!drunk!
This is the same results that many guys are getting when they make the change to ATF in the primary. We have several members here that are using the AMSOIL ATF type F Supershift fluid. Only had a few go back to motor oil in their primary due to clutch grabbing to hard for their comfort level.
george
 

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I did a much needed clutch adjustment on mine today and changed the primary fluid to Dexron III after reading this thread and the difference is amazing. Shifts so much better. No clunking and finding neutral is so much easier. Thanks fellas!!
 

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I interested in trying an ATF in my M8. I ride in some hot weather (100f) and a little concerned about shear. Being ATF is about a 10 WT there is not much room for shear loss.

What ATF would be best ... ATF +4 possibly?
 

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I interested in trying an ATF in my M8. I ride in some hot weather (100f) and a little concerned about shear. Being ATF is about a 10 WT there is not much room for shear loss.

What ATF would be best ... ATF +4 possibly?
ATF is not rated for the compensator. Just fill it with Redline primary fluid and you'll be happy.
 

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I run Synthetic 75-80 Trans oil its recommended for wet clutch, Also Remember Chain & Sprocket & Compensator need Lubrication. I use to use ATF But i have changed to Trans Oil
 

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Holy Bat Crap Batman I switched to Mercon and it gets better every ride not near the clunk or finding neutral like it used to be. Cllutch grabs and giddyup and go I have tried Amsoil ,Redline Mobile1 before think Im sticking with this .
 

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First of all I want to state that I'm no engineer and the observations here are from personal experience and 40+ years as a auto and bike repair shop owner/mechanic. In the last 30 years I've built well over 1000 automatics for every application from stock to all out race applications in 1000+hp race cars and monster trucks.

For those of you (including myself) that use ATF in the primary here's some facts that I have verified over the years.
There are approximately 25 types of ATF but I'll cover the 5 most common as the other twenty are either obsolete or very vehicle specific.

Type F or (Ford) fluid was developed for and used in Ford automatic transmissions back when the clutch discs were made of sintered bronze or asbestos and there were no bearings used. All parts were supported by bronze bushings and thrust washers. It is essentially 20wt hydraulic oil (pure mineral oil) with a red dye and that's it. It is commonly sold as Racing ATF under brands such as B&M Trick Shift because it provides the quickest lockup of the clutch packs (Hardest shift). It has no place in 99.9 percent of modern applications unless you're just looking for neck snapping shifts (or in the case of motorcycles used for drag racing where quick and harsh clutch engagement is the primary goal and you're gonna change it very often.

Dexron II and III are the most commonly used fluids with the only difference being additives in Dexron III to make it more compatible with the electronics used in modern transmissions.
They both have an additive package that includes friction modifiers for smoother cluch engagement, oxidation control, viscosity stabilizers, corrosion inhibitors and proper lubrication of bearings and bushings of all types. Since the advent of gerotor pumps and better friction materials such as Kevlar and Aramid, Dexron II or III has even replaced the use of Type F for racing use by most transmission builders.
Dexron III is commonly used in many automotive manual tranmissions and is probably used in more transfer cases of 4WD vehicles than any other fluid.

ATF+3 uses higher quality base oils with the highest content of friction modifiers to prevent torque converter shudder. It lubricates a bit better than Dexron III but can also cause slow clutch engagment (slipping). If you ride easy and your primary goal is smooth clutch engagment then this is the fluid to use in your primary if you're gonna run ATF.

Synthetic ATF comes in many formulations but the most common is Dexron III. It has the same properties of clutch engagement as Dexron III with some advantages.
The main advantage of synthetic fluid is it's ability to resist thermal breakdown. If you ride in extreme heat or just want to extend your primary fluid change intervals then this is probably your fluid.

You may want to think about this too. Although the primary doesn't generate much heat in and of itself that's not the only concern when choosing a fluid.
The primary on your motorcycle is not a seperate entity. It is attached to the engine and it acts as a giant heatsink for that engine. The temps seen on a long hard run are probably within 20-40 degress of the engine oil temp.
Mineral based ATF starts to break down at around 220 degrees and is almost useless as a lubricant at 250 degrees.
On most Harley's the rear exhaust is in close proximity to the primary case and that adds heat too.

I have measured the temp on my primary after a hard run and have never seen temps above 180 degrees but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. If you ride loaded, two up, in heavy traffic, the desert, or alot of hard pulls in the mountains then you'll probably see temps over 200 degrees.

Most people notice that shifting is immediately improved when they change over to ATF in the primary. This is because ATF is designed for wet clutches. When you pull the clutch in it releases cleaner than with motor oil. You'll also notice that finding neutral is no longer a chore.

Personally I use any major brand of regular Dexron III and change it out every 5000 miles but if I did alot of the riding described above I would probably use synthetic (although I am a cheap old bastard).

I'm not promoting the use of ATF in the primary!
But!
ATF has proven itself in hundreds of millions of auto applications and tens of millions of manual tranmissions and transfer cases.
You almost never see a 4wd transfer case failure anymore and I've personally seen 4wd trucks with a quarter million miles on a manual transmission and transfer case using Dexron III and still going strong.

I feel comfortable using it in my primary and I love not hearing the rattle when I snick it into first. But what I really love is not fussing with trying to find neutral on a cold day. And the over 300,000 miles I've put on primary's with ATF without a single lube related failure doesn't hurt either.

Geno:coffee:
Excellent right up. I to have been an auto mechanic (Chrysler) for 50 yrs and have been building bikes for most of that time as a side hack. I have always used ATF in the primary's that I did not convert to belt. I find the same results as you, smother shifting, less clunk and no neutral hunting. As an added bonus modern ATF is blended to operate with electronics used in most/all new transmissions. A lot of people blame the clunk and neutral hunting on the transmission's not realizing most of the time it is the clutch packs dragging and not releasing cleanly that cause the problem. Again thanks for the great right up.
 
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