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Infidel
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Will the stock clutch hold okay if the engine is in the 100/100 range? Would it be worth it to get the SE spring?
 

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XLIII
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The new '06 "Reduced Effort" ramps and the SE Heavy Duty spring will give you about the same pull as your stock '05 setup w/ no danger of slipping. The SE spring by itself increases pull a noticable amount.
Some folks report no slipping w/ stock setup, and some are kicking themselves in the butt for not going heavier while it was apart as they are experiencing slipping after their build.
You pays your pesos and you takes your chances...
 

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You don't say?
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Gulfstream said:
Will the stock clutch hold okay if the engine is in the 100/100 range? Would it be worth it to get the SE spring?
The stock spring will make the clutch less prone to slipping, but will stiffen up the lever quite a bit. I don't have an issue with it, however other people have said it's tough. I run a 100/100 motor and have since replaced the clutch pack because I scored a major clearance deal on the SE friction.
 

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XLIII
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Duoglide_62 said:
The stock spring will make the clutch less prone to slipping, but will stiffen up the lever quite a bit. I don't have an issue with it, however other people have said it's tough. I run a 100/100 motor and have since replaced the clutch pack because I scored a major clearance deal on the SE friction.
Um, the SE is heavier than stock...
 

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You need something.
If the bike is pre 04 the stock friction pack / diaphragm might hold 100/100 for a while (the 04 thru 06 will not), but why take out a friction pack. Use at least the SE diaphragm.
If lever effort is a issue you can easily run the stock setup with a VPC, I can give you info on it via e mail.
 

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Premium Member
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Horse power has a lot to do with the issue of clucth slippage....But don't forget that the amount of gravitational force exerted by the lump sitting on the seat has a lot to do with it too. For someone hauling a lite load the stock stuff may work well. But if some beer gutted fool (like myself) gets on the clutch may :puke:
 

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Nice to ride again :-)
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At risk I will say I find very little difference between the SE and stock spring in pull effort. That is just me and I am not a weight lifter, except a "pounder" at a time.

I also lube the he$$ out of my cable and I prefer a lot of gray area in my clutch adjustment. I am probably out 3/4 of a turn from snug.

I am considering the VPC as I am going in very soon and want to do all I want, or think I want, while I am in the primary this time.

Others like Mega have had great success with the new ramps in eliminating extra clutch pull while increasing spring strength with the SE.

I need to ask how slippage would show in a build?

Although I do ride hard, I have never knowingly felt my clutch slip. I have never done a hole shot or anything like that though, never smoked the rear tire, except with the brakes. By hard I mean I use a lot of shifting, RPM, compression, brakes, and throttle in the twisties and a lot of WOT on the straits.
 

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Infidel
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
HIPPO said:
You need something.
If the bike is pre 04 the stock friction pack / diaphragm might hold 100/100 for a while (the 04 thru 06 will not), but why take out a friction pack. Use at least the SE diaphragm.
If lever effort is a issue you can easily run the stock setup with a VPC, I can give you info on it via e mail.
email sent Hippo, I appreciate the info. Looks like I'll need the SE spring at the least...I have a 05. What's the VPC?
 

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The stock 04 and 05 diaphragm is 10% lighter then the earlier diaphragms, ie 300 lbs vs 330 lbs (the SE is 380 lbs), at spec installed height.
The 06 is different, ie the effort on it is reverse progressive with disengagement travel (this is why it feels so much lighter), theoretically it has the same clamping force as the 04-05 but it not always works out that way (suspect it to be very sensitive to stack height due to it's design).

You need a fairly fancy spring machine to plot clamping force vs. effort, but with it it becomes real clear. One can also see some production variance between springs with the same part number, as well as fatigued or work hardened diaphragms.
There are two types of slip wether you notice them or not, slip under power while engaged and slip during shifts which to some extent is always there (closer to clutch capacity more even if it does not slip while engaged {this is why it takes out the friction pack after a while if excessive} even if initially it seemed fine)
The former can be seen on a dyno graph plotting engine rpm vs road speed and the latter during all gear runs.

The VPC in addition to increasing clamping force (ie capacity with a given combination of parts) at higher rpm significantly reduces the normal slip during shifts, it becomes obvious when you run two equal bikes hard against each other. Put a VPC onto one of them and they still run neck to neck as before thru the gears, but at the instant of the shift the bike with the VPC makes a bike lenght on the other during the higher gear shifts ie 3-4 and 4-5, and sometimes even during the 2-3 shift.
 

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As long as we're on the subject I have a question about the VPC I recently purchased form you for my 98" build on my 05 Eglide. Would the SE spring be a good idea or is it totally unnecessary with the VPC?

Can anyone give me the part # for the 06 ramps?

Thanks,
Rick
 

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Yet another 43 Double D
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not to hijack but...

Hippo,

Sorry to aid in hijacking this thread but I've got the SE Clutch Spring and have been thinking getting the VPC to get back to the lighter 06 stock clutch pull. :hmmm:

Appreciate any info you'd like to share
 

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eglider05 said:
As long as we're on the subject I have a question about the VPC I recently purchased form you for my 98" build on my 05 Eglide. Would the SE spring be a good idea or is it totally unnecessary with the VPC?

Can anyone give me the part # for the 06 ramps?

Thanks,
Rick
The VP83t with the stock diaphragm and the stock primary ratio has enough excess capacity to handle the engine torque, while adding the SE diaphragm doesn't hurt anything effort goes up accordingly and too much excess capacity achieves nothing.

To give you an idea, before we had the VP92t we ran the VP83t with the SE diaphragm on 120's and 124's, Kari the Finn had this combination with 140 or 145TQ. It all depends on the TQ curve and the primary ratio.


Joe, just e mail me to the adress a couple posts up, every combination is a bit different and I need the data.

I have the part# for the full kit, 36808-05, the separate ramps have part #'s 25604-00A and 25605-00A stamped on them.
 

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HIPPO said:
The VP83t with the stock diaphragm and the stock primary ratio has enough excess capacity to handle the engine torque, while adding the SE diaphragm doesn't hurt anything effort goes up accordingly and too much excess capacity achieves nothing.

To give you an idea, before we had the VP92t we ran the VP83t with the SE diaphragm on 120's and 124's, Kari the Finn had this combination with 140 or 145TQ. It all depends on the TQ curve and the primary ratio.


Joe, just e mail me to the adress a couple posts up, every combination is a bit different and I need the data.

I have the part# for the full kit, 36808-05, the separate ramps have part #'s 25604-00A and 25605-00A stamped on them.
Thanks for the reply and the part numbers. I think I'll just go with the ramps. It seems I recall you recommended I stay with the 05 spring as opposed to the 06.

Rick
 

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XLIII
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Since the ramps were new in '05 for the '06 bikes, methinks I'd probably get the part numbers from the dealer out of an '06 parts manual, since the cast in part numbers are often different than the numbers on the box, and those are the numbers you need. Numbers above could be part numbers, but are probably casting numbers so I'd check the parts manual to be sure.
Those ramps have NOT been around since 2000 as the number above would indicate. I got the kit and just used a SE spring instead of the included one, so I can't help w/ the part numbers since I don't know where the instruction sheet is.
 

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Part #'s for the 06 Ramps are as follows;

25604-00A Inner Ramp
25605-00A Outer Ramp
8873 Ball (3)
37882-06 Spring, clutch

These are out of the 06 Touring Model parts catalog. FWIW, I bought the Inner and Outer and 3 Balls for around $17 from Zanotti's. I plan on using them w/ an 03 spring and VPC 83T. My motor should produce at least 100/100 and I don't expect any slipping. Just my -2$en#e-
:duh?:
 

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XLIII
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Outstanding! Sorry for doubting Hippo's numbers, but I really figured the change they made to the ramps for '06 would have been considered worthy of more than an alpha revision...
I'll slink off now.
 

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RoadKingCurley said:
Part #'s for the 06 Ramps are as follows;

25604-00A Inner Ramp
25605-00A Outer Ramp
8873 Ball (3)
37882-06 Spring, clutch

These are out of the 06 Touring Model parts catalog. FWIW, I bought the Inner and Outer and 3 Balls for around $17 from Zanotti's. I plan on using them w/ an 03 spring and VPC 83T. My motor should produce at least 100/100 and I don't expect any slipping. Just my -2$en#e-
:duh?:
Thanks for the additional part numbers.

Rick
 
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