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Discussion Starter #1
How is the best way to check for rod bearing failure?
 

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Check your drain plug magnet for metal...also open your oil filter and check for metal...do NOT cut your filter with a HACK SAW...I use a air chisel
Hope it is a false alarm
Steve The Dyno Man
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I've had some metal pass through the oil pump(scratches) and also some scratches on the cam support plate on the inboard side at the pinion shaft. After pulling out the cams and rotating them while still mounted in the cam support plate I notice a rough spot(geared cams). I removed the bearings and could see no damage. Removed the inboard cam bearing and found nothing. Everything else appears normal. I cannont find the source of the metal and have not found the metal that passed through the cam cavity. I assume it is in the filter or perhaps a previous filter. My concern is finding the source of the metal. The bike has about 60K miles. It is set up as follows: S&S geared cams51G, Fueling oil pump, Fueling cam support plate,
Fueling tappets, S&S adjustable push rods, roller rockers, 95" flat top pistons,
heads cc'd, ported & flowed by big boyz, terrys ignition. I put about 25K miles with this setup before the noise started. I've never pulled a bottom end apart. I want to be sure before I go into the botton end.b
 

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Rods

Certainly the root of the "shavings" is a very large concern.
Usually you need to remove the front cylinder and check for up and down movement on the male rod when it is nearing BDC. If ANY is felt, then re-fitment is needed. This will be the begining of the end.
If neglected for any period of time once that is evident, you will hear a "hollow" noise in the lower half of the engine. Particulaly when it warms. That is a noise that no one looks forward to hearing. Not the end of the world. Just needs to be addressed.
Unless I looked at the balance sheets, on file in the office, I would not even venture a guess as to how many cranks we have re-built for in-house builds as well as for other shops over the years.
Scott
 

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Steve Handy said:
YES...high load and low oil pressure
Steve,

Is that the "knock" a lot of bikes make on first start up and then goes away when warm, or is it a constant knock hot and cold? Mine does the tapping thing when starting up cold, but the tapping sound goes away once the bike is warmed up. A service writer told me "they all do that, some are just louder than others".

Mark​
 

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Noise ????

Paniolo said:


Steve,

Is that the "knock" a lot of bikes make on first start up and then goes away when warm, or is it a constant knock hot and cold? Mine does the tapping thing when starting up cold, but the tapping sound goes away once the bike is warmed up. A service writer told me "they all do that, some are just louder than others".

Mark​
Mark, You have a good question...BUT I can not explain a noise I cant hear....many possibilites-primary noise-valve train noise -piston slap-gear drive cams (like mine)-exhaust snap(leak) just to name a few...sorry I couldnt be more help
Steve The Dyno Man :cheers:
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Hillsidecycle.com said:
Certainly the root of the "shavings" is a very large concern.
Usually you need to remove the front cylinder and check for up and down movement on the male rod when it is nearing BDC. If ANY is felt, then re-fitment is needed. This will be the begining of the end.
If neglected for any period of time once that is evident, you will hear a "hollow" noise in the lower half of the engine. Particulaly when it warms. That is a noise that no one looks forward to hearing. Not the end of the world. Just needs to be addressed.
Unless I looked at the balance sheets, on file in the office, I would not even venture a guess as to how many cranks we have re-built for in-house builds as well as for other shops over the years.
Scott
Yeah; my luck probably is the crank. Already had one replaced in my 2000 Flhri. I went with an S&S 106". I had a shop do it. I've vowed since then to do all my own repairs. Can you rebuild a crank for a twin cam?
 

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Steve Handy said:
Mark, You have a good question...BUT I can not explain a noise I cant hear....many possibilites-primary noise-valve train noise -piston slap-gear drive cams (like mine)-exhaust snap(leak) just to name a few...sorry I couldnt be more help
Steve The Dyno Man :cheers:
It's probably gear drive cams, I have the 26gs. I checked the exhaust manifold bolts, and they are tight. The juggs and pistons are new, KB 96.5 from AMS, so it's probably not piston slap. It could be valve train. Like I said, it mostly goes away when the engine is warmed up.

Thanks

Mark​
 

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IronButt
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You could have a small amount of play in the wrist pin bushing as well, they heat up fairly fast, as there are being warmed by the combustion heat through the piston. They wil give you more of a double knock, but if they are just slightly worn hard to hear the difference until they wear more. But that and rods are a common thing to check when a build is done. We also check every set rockers for wear and rocker to support plate. Have seen plenty of bikes that had excessive clearance there new and old.
 

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HDWRENCH said:
You could have a small amount of play in the wrist pin bushing as well, they heat up fairly fast, as there are being warmed by the combustion heat through the piston. They wil give you more of a double knock, but if they are just slightly worn hard to hear the difference until they wear more. But that and rods are a common thing to check when a build is done. We also check every set rockers for wear and rocker to support plate. Have seen plenty of bikes that had excessive clearance there new and old.
How do you correct the play in the rockers/support plate? Also is it the wrist pin or the bushing that gets worn? If it is the bushing is there a special tool needed to replace the bushing? How many miles before the bushing usually shows wear? thanks
 

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IronButt
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Yes the wrist pin bushing is the wear item , you need a installer/ removal tool for the bushing, a reamer, and a hone kit to hone to final size. You measure the ID of the bushing and OD of the pin and from there figure the spec you have and it is either good or bad. As for miles , I have seen where they where too tight from the factory and the clearanced themselves once running ( not a good thing)
 

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Lugging

Paniolo said:
Just curious, does lugging cause rod bearing failure?
Yes it will, ie 6th gear in the new bikes?!?!
 

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Knock

Paniolo said:


Steve,

Is that the "knock" a lot of bikes make on first start up and then goes away when warm, or is it a constant knock hot and cold? Mine does the tapping thing when starting up cold, but the tapping sound goes away once the bike is warmed up. A service writer told me "they all do that, some are just louder than others".

Mark​
The "knock" you may be refering to may be a lifter that may bleed off a touch when sitting. When once fired off, it will pump up, and low and behold, the noise disappears, as oil circulation once occurs. Are you running the SYN III? The service writer would rather go back to reading his latest copy of "How to Sidestep Problems 101".
 

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Hillsidecycle.com said:
The "knock" you may be refering to may be a lifter that may bleed off a touch when sitting. When once fired off, it will pump up, and low and behold, the noise disappears, as oil circulation once occurs. Are you running the SYN III? The service writer would rather go back to reading his latest copy of "How to Sidestep Problems 101".
I found the knock at start up. It was a loose exhaust shield hitting the head. Like I said earlier, I know I have gear cam noise, and some valve train noise, which is probably the "clicking" I hear as I accelerate. I just changed the oil, so my next time I'll go back to Syn 3 and see what happens.​
 

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Paniolo said:


I found the knock at start up. It was a loose exhaust shield hitting the head. Like I said earlier, I know I have gear cam noise, and some valve train noise, which is probably the "clicking" I hear as I accelerate. I just changed the oil, so my next time I'll go back to Syn 3 and see what happens.​
That certainly is a lot better than a new bottom end! It's the simple crap that we aften neglect and go right in for the worst.

Glad it was an cheap fix!

Regards,
NC
 

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nc-renegade said:
It's the simple crap that we aften neglect and go right in for the worst.
It's taken me almost 50 years not to think the worst whenever I hear something, or the vehicle starts acting up.​
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Hillsidecycle.com said:
Certainly the root of the "shavings" is a very large concern.
Usually you need to remove the front cylinder and check for up and down movement on the male rod when it is nearing BDC. If ANY is felt, then re-fitment is needed. This will be the begining of the end.
If neglected for any period of time once that is evident, you will hear a "hollow" noise in the lower half of the engine. Particulaly when it warms. That is a noise that no one looks forward to hearing. Not the end of the world. Just needs to be addressed.
Unless I looked at the balance sheets, on file in the office, I would not even venture a guess as to how many cranks we have re-built for in-house builds as well as for other shops over the years.
Scott
I've pulled both cylinders off and cannot detect any up and down movement. I have some side to side movement. I am at a loss as to where the metal came from and what was causing the "knock". Piston skirts have very little scratching on the teflon. Cylinders look perfect as do the rings. Heads look great also. I can't see putting it back together without finding the source of my problem. Any ideas; anyone?
 
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