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Piston fit would have shown quite a bit sooner than 10k miles, wouldn't it. Or does it depend entirely on how poor it fits?

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Not if it was a round piston in a something other than round jug.
 

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Piston fit would have shown quite a bit sooner than 10k miles, wouldn't it. Or does it depend entirely on how poor it fits?

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Possibly, but consider the air temp seemed to be pretty cool. "Removed 7 layers of clothes and hats etc to keep me warm."

Cylinders were receiving a blast of cool air while the engine labors for 2 hours pushing a touring machine @ 85 MPH into a 40+ MPH headwind. Cool cylinders don't grow as much as hot cylinders but the pistons are being pushed to the extreme. If the clearance was on the tight side this condition could have been the breaking point.
 

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Here are photos requested. Let me know if you want different looks or whatever. View attachment 267493 View attachment 267494 View attachment 267495 View attachment 267496
A) You have hard metal circulating through that motor. Tappet bores and the crank pin/bearing/rod races are all suspect at this point

B) Those compression rings have jagged ends, did they go in like that, or get like that in the motor? Getting like that in the motor would be a bad overheating issue, or being set to tight in an oval/irregular bore.

C) That piston shows signs of rocking in the bore.

Pull the rings and clean the carbon off of the sides of that piston and drop it back in the jug. Then see how much feeler gauge you can fit in between them.
 

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Possibly, but consider the air temp seemed to be pretty cool. "Removed 7 layers of clothes and hats etc to keep me warm."

Cylinders were receiving a blast of cool air while the engine labors for 2 hours pushing a touring machine @ 85 MPH into a 40+ MPH headwind. Cool cylinders don't grow as much as hot cylinders but the pistons are being pushed to the extreme. If the clearance was on the tight side this condition could have been the breaking point.
Possible. But at speed where the air flow is ample, the jugs just don't see that much difference 260-300 jug temps vs 35 or 45f or vs 70f. Its 25 degrees, or about 10% to the jug. Should really need to get to above 95f to begin causing an issue.

Now once what ever happened got going, the jugs probably heated up quite a lot more. But that would be after the failure started. The scoring of hardened tappet steel in the photos above says a lot. That stuff usually comes from crank pins and oil pumps. But could be a bearing roller or race too. But again, it will be hard to say what happened first.

That tappet says the motor needs to go down to bare cases and the crank pin needs to be inspected. IMHO, those jugs are door stops now, as is every roller bearing in that motor. So he's in the price range of a crate motor. Drop the pan and either clean or replace it, then put a crate motor in and be done with it.
 

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Discussion Starter #26
A) You have hard metal circulating through that motor. Tappet bores and the crank pin/bearing/rod races are all suspect at this point

B) Those compression rings have jagged ends, did they go in like that, or get like that in the motor? Getting like that in the motor would be a bad overheating issue, or being set to tight in an oval/irregular bore.

C) That piston shows signs of rocking in the bore.

Pull the rings and clean the carbon off of the sides of that piston and drop it back in the jug. Then see how much feeler gauge you can fit in between them.
Ok will do. Thank you
 

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Discussion Starter #27
All my clips were in correct. The wrist pins all good. Nothing except that oil ring has been out of place. That and the witness marks in the exhaust pushrod where it had to start hitting the tube. Even those are minor however.
 

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All my clips were in correct. The wrist pins all good. Nothing except that oil ring has been out of place. That and the witness marks in the exhaust pushrod where it had to start hitting the tube. Even those are minor however.
Lets see what the front jug looks like.
 

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The finish on the outside diameter of those lifters is trashed.I can only imagine what the aluminum case lifter bores look like.At some point there has been metal contamination floating through your engine.

In your case and given your experience,I would go with a replacement engine of some type.

What you have can be salvaged but the lifter bores would need to be machined first.I'm sure the finish (micro) on your crank journals and rod pin are rough as hell too.

The list of compromised and or damaged engine components goes on and on.

Even if you do all the wrenching yourself it would not be cost effective to salvage what you have vs a complete bolt in engine.
 

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Discussion Starter #32
Lets see what the front jug looks like.
Here are pics of the front jugs.
267563
267564
267565
267566

ive got completely tore down now and the oil pump and camplate are still in good shape. The only place I鈥檝e found damages is the lifters and the witness marks around the bases of them. Also the jugs and pistons. All I can come up with is the bottom oil scraper and rings there came out of groove of the piston and I just rode the hell out of her not knowing. I鈥檓 getting th8ngs cleaned up today and I鈥檒l check the piston to jugs clearances and lifter bores etc... if there is anything at all you know I should check please let me know. I honestly think I just screwed up when reinstalling the rear jug an$ let that scraper come out or sometime after it came out. I don鈥檛 know but that鈥檚 all I can think of from what I鈥檝e found.
 

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Discussion Starter #34
yes I put new pistons in new bored and honed jugs. They were the stock jugs bored out to 3.937鈥 or something like that.
 

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Discussion Starter #35
I have these very little witness marks on the camplate. I know that鈥檚 a area where the oil pump sucks the oil. My question is these are so small you can barely feel. Do you think this plate is ok to use still. Should I leave alone or take some fine 2500 grit sandpaper and polish smooth.
267676
 

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yes I put new pistons in new bored and honed jugs. They were the stock jugs bored out to 3.937鈥 or something like that.
Who did the jugs, and what did the skirt clearance measure when you assembled them? Better yet, pull the rings and put the front piston back in the jug, then stick a feeler gauge between the jug and piston skirt.
 

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I have these very little witness marks on the camplate. I know that鈥檚 a area where the oil pump sucks the oil. My question is these are so small you can barely feel. Do you think this plate is ok to use still. Should I leave alone or take some fine 2500 grit sandpaper and polish smooth. View attachment 267676

Nothing in that motor is reusable until it has been thoroughly cleaned and inspected. That means pushing the bushings and bearings out of the plate, and replacing them.
 

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listen to therm,, don, and a couple of others who have addressed your problem..,, if the cam plate scratches are so shallow that they wont catch a nail,,, some fine sandpaper, on a sanding block should be ok. i cant actuall6 say for sure, since i cant touch it..
 

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Discussion Starter #39
listen to therm,, don, and a couple of others who have addressed your problem..,, if the cam plate scratches are so shallow that they wont catch a nail,,, some fine sandpaper, on a sanding block should be ok. i cant actuall6 say for sure, since i cant touch it..
I could definitely get it out with some 2000 grit wet dry sandpaper and maybe some extra fine steel wool. They are that minor. I already have tore all the way down and cleaned everything up waiting on parts. The only thing I haven鈥檛 cleaned is the camplate and cams just because I haven鈥檛 gotten there yet. I鈥檒l ge5 those cleaned up over weekend. Hopefully get some parts in and get my case back from machine shop by end of the week. You guys have wonderful weekend. Thanks
brian
Who did the jugs, and what did the skirt clearance measure when you assembled them? Better yet, pull the rings and put the front piston back in the jug, then stick a feeler gauge between the jug and piston skirt.
i didn鈥檛 personally measure as I paid a company to do that and when I received back from the shop the rings were gapped and pistons installed into jugs so I just put wrist pin and ring in and go. It Was supposed to be perfect fit And it was a reputable company. Everyone knows them. I don鈥檛 want to seem like I鈥檓 blaming them though. Probably something I made mistake on but I can tell you that one piston fits much easier then the other. I鈥檒l check measurements and let you know. I鈥檝e been
Who did the jugs, and what did the skirt clearance measure when you assembled them? Better yet, pull the rings and put the front piston back in the jug, then stick a feeler gauge between the jug and piston skirt.
how should I check the piston to wall clearance. I don鈥檛 have any torque plates. should I just slide loose piston into loose jug Amd see what it says. Even though It Won鈥檛 be torqued to 42lbs or anything at all will this help?
 
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