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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I very recently joined this forum. When entering the site, it was clear as a bell to me there was no affiliation whatsoever with Harley-Davidson Motor Company or any of the companies it operates.

I am a writer by trade and am not foreign to some intellectual property issues. There have been relatively recent changes in intellectual property laws I am quite familiar.

As step 1, I'd suggest an intellectual property attorney be contacted to review this site to make an initial evaluation of the "case weight" of each side of the issue. This should not be particularly expensive and we could drum up those bucks quite easily, judging from unanimous member backing.

Although Harley-Davidson, Inc. operates several companies under different names, their official name is hypenated, i.e., Harley-Davidson. Why they can't assume a hypenated URL, avoid bad press, and avoid alienating dedicated customers is beyond me. Of course, it could be that the attorney doesn't know the formal name of his employer.

Bottom line, I suggest we pitch in and consult with a knowledgeable intellectual property attorney, and take it from there.

Sorry to be so wordy, but this is an issue that gets under my skin like it apparently does others.

nodawgs
 

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
I'm posting to my own post

Hey!...that's a darn good question!

If Harley-Davidson's actual name is hypenated, why don't they merely grab the URL that truly corresponds to their real company name...which is indeed hypenated.

As this site is of no detriment whatsoever to their business or sales operations, then what is the motive for vigorously going after an established site already having a viable member base?

The answer to that is so obvious, it needs no explanation. I also suspect that responding to that question is going to be rather awkward.

Yessir...that I'd like to see. I'd probably have to sit on my hands just to keep from hugging myself.

Nodawgs
 

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nodawgs,
You're getting me all excited about this legal mumbo jumbo stuff, amybe I better sit on my hands too in order from hugging myself. HA!
Let me pat you on the back -- good question. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
This thought will knock your socks off!

What's the deal, here? Seems like I get my best ideas sitting on the throne. Anybody else do that? Maybe I should just glue a ring on my butt.

Truth is, most intellectual property controversies never reach the courthouse steps and are settled out. Just suppose that we call their bluff and let this one take its course.

Just suppose that a good part of this entire membership elects to have a group ride. Just suppose the destination just coincidentally happened to be to the courthouse of jurisdiction. Just suppose we coincidentall cruised into town on the same day of the hearing...maybe getting there a tad early and taking up every parking space around the courthouse and a couple of blocks in every direction. Whoa!...a packed courtroom, huh.

Now, I'm a weiny level writer, but I'm an old fart that's established some heavy-weight buds in the media business in the last 35 years. Some are now top dogs as business editors of the top major metropolitan newspapers in the country. I think the Wallstreet Journal would find this one amusing. I mean...after all, this is business news...and the public needs to stay informed. Of course with bikes populating a block or two of the entire area, the local media is going to get onto this one real quick. I have buds at USA Today that'd love this one...and others around the country I want mention just now.

WOW! This is going to be a costly undertaking for someone. I hope they and their pink-nosed lawyer think it's worth it as opposed to merely taking a URL that corresponds to their real name and leaving ours alone...yeah, their real name has a dash (-) between the two first words.

Nodawgs
 

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Damn No D ! It must be as hot in Plano as it is here in Houston.

Fact is their site allows for use of names and Logos and graphics SO LONG AS IT IS FOR PERSONAL USE.

I figgured out that the reason they had been here and laying back and saying nothing is because until recently, there was no "Online Store" being mentioned.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Trademarks and Domain Names

The Internet is amazing, isn't it? Throw out amass query, and darned if you can't find a dozen Intellectual Property Lawyers that also ride our brand of bikes. Nothing wrong with a little membership drive, now is it? I just do believe we could even up the score...uh...plus some.

Here's a copy/paste a black leather-jacketed counselor sent:

"Depending on which way they go, they can't even get past 1-3, much less items 1-4 below that. Of course, they can always try the Federal Court system. Tell'um to come on."


Domain Name Disputes
ICANN's Uniform Domain Name Dispute Resolution Policy

May 1, 2001

What Must a Trademark Owner Prove to Win a UDRP Arbitration?

A complainant must prove EACH of the following elements to win a UDRP arbitration:

1.The domain name is identical or confusingly similar to a trademark or service mark in which the complainant has rights;

2.The domain name owner does not have any rights or legitimate interests in respect of the domain name; and

3.The domain name owner registered the domain name and is using it in "bad faith."


What is Bad Faith?

The UDRP lists the following nonexclusive circumstances as evidence of bad faith in the registration and use of a domain name:

1.Circumstances indicating that the domain name owner registered the domain name or acquired the domain name primarily for the purpose of selling, renting, or otherwise transferring the domain name registration to the complainant who is the owner of the trademark or service mark or to a competitor of that complainant, for valuable consideration in excess of your documented out-of-pocket costs directly related to the domain name; or

2.The domain name owner registered the domain name to prevent the owner of the trademark or service mark from reflecting the mark in a corresponding domain name, provided that the domain name owner has engaged in a pattern of such conduct; or

3.The domain name owner registered the domain name primarily for the purpose of disrupting the business of a competitor; or

4.By using the domain name, the domain name owner has intentionally attempted to attract, for commercial gain, internet users to the domain name owner's web site or other on-line location, by creating a likelihood of confusion with the complainant's mark as to the source, sponsorship, affiliation, or endorsement of the domain name owner's web site or location or of a product or service on the domain name owner's web site or location.

nodawgs
 

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Good post NODAWGS, and welcome to the Forum!

You have brought up some very good points. I have already posted a retainer. Just waiting for "their" next move.

They are amazing aren't they?
 

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Ole man HD's pockets are deep. Just look at the way they gouge us on the price of new bikes. I know, the company claims the dealers do it. Does anyone really believe HD can't apply pressure to the dealers to treat its riders better? I think HD ought to get out of the internet business and stay in the garage.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Guess you're right about the Internet space and saying more about me than words can explain...except it says something you likely couldn't relate.

I'm an old worn-out sob with cancer from one end to the other that sometimes can't do much else. Too damned much time on my hands, I suppose. You're right. I try to straddle a Fat Boy on good days and lately that hasn't been too often.

As to making you ill, I had a dawg once that acted like you. Come to find out, he was wormy. You might want to have that checked out.

As to riding, I was likely kick-starting 74FLs when your poop was still tan.

You take over

Outta here

nodawgs
 

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Good points nodawgs you have managed to put into words everything that was running in my head but I believe that JimmyK has a point... and usually it is always the easiest answer. Simply once the on-line store was going to hit the site that was it. That's what they been kicking back waiting for. Whatever I'm supporting dprice, I'm a fairly new member but this site rocks. Keep those ideas flowing nodawgs keeps me from having to do alot of typing.

Cheri aka medicine woman

Beach Cruzin
 

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Oh one more thing. Dprice how about inviting Harley-Davidson into the cyber boxing ring???? We then could post bets. Get some money coming in.

cheri aka medicine woman
 

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Welcome nodawgs,& thanks for posting.

I see quibbling,name calling,pettiness & other assorted ilk regularly in OTHER places.At this time it would be WISE of us ALL to stick together & RESPECT EVERYONES ideas for the sake of this forum!

We're ALL in this together,let's leave our egos at the door! Thanks everyone.
guido
 

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Re: Lawyers

highrider said:
and don;t take this so Fn serious
But it is...... FU(KING SERIOUS

And lets just hope he'll be back with his wise words..... and not, "Outta here"...:(
 

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nodawgs, I feel bad you're so sick with cancer and I don't even know you. I hope you feel beter soon and get to riding.

Anyways here is my opinion. The MOCO doesn't want a forum period. The reason why is because when someone gets pissed they can come here and publicly whine about the MOCO. I think that is the bottom line and the online store. Mainly it is a place where it is possible to have unhappy owners complain like JimmyK did (even though Jimmy has a very valid point) they just don't want anything negative public. If HD wanted a forum they would have one. Their webmasters surely tried to sell them one right?

So I think the only way a forum will exist is if HD is allowed to moderate and edit, but that can't work because they would have to hire people to constantly watch the board.

Oh well, back to drinking.....no sense in stopping while there is a 6 pack in the fridge!
:p
 

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Smokey said:
The MOCO doesn't want a forum period. The reason why is because when someone gets pissed they can come here and publicly whine about the MOCO. I think that is the bottom line and the online store. Mainly it is a place where it is possible to have unhappy owners complain like JimmyK did (even though Jimmy has a very valid point) they just don't want anything negative public. If HD wanted a forum they would have one. Their webmasters surely tried to sell them one right?

So I think the only way a forum will exist is if HD is allowed to moderate and edit, but that can't work because they would have to hire people to constantly watch the board.
Well put, Smokey.
 

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Very well put. HD can't stand bad p.r. Stop and think about how many "public" areas there are for people with a legitimate gripe. Think you could buy an ad in any motorcycle magazine to gripe about HD? No freakin' way. HD would jump on them like chickens on a June bug (Texas colloquialism). I wonder if they would have said anything if we had nothing but praise for the MoCo? Fall down on your knees and pray to the HD gods. I've been fortunate enough to not have had any problems with them, yet. Years ago HD needed folks like us (working class) to support them. Now it's the "IN" thing if you own a Harley. I didn't buy one to be "IN". They can afford to shun the little people until something more trendy and fashionable comes along. Think they'll be looking for us then? Like so many others...they forgot where they came from and who put them there. I like my scooter and will continue to ride it and get whatever I need for it from HD (if the price is reasonable). And I'll still be riding it when the RUBs decide to go a different direction.
 

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dave51 said:
.........jump on them like chickens on a June bug (Texas colloquialism).
We say that in Georgia also.

Back around 81, I was riding Honda CB360 down toward lake one Sunday morning going to meet some friends. I was cruising about 90 and saw june bug coming long way off(bright green sucker...kinda hard to miss). I figured he'd splat on the windshield of the fairing. WRONG!!!. Cleared the fairing about 2 inches and caught me smack dab in middle of forehead. Almost knocked me off bike. I was all over road. Pulled over and sat on side of road for about 15 minutes to calm down.
 

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Re: Re: Lawyers

harleyhog said:


But it is...... FU(KING SERIOUS

And lets just hope he'll be back with his wise words..... and not, "Outta here"...:(

He's outta here...Not sure what got his goat, but he wanted me to remove him from the rolls....so be it..
 
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