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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I installed a new SE chrome a/c backing plate w/ K&N element, and also a pair of SE torque slip ons. Seems to run a little soft at full throttle, so was thinking of getting a PC III (w/ O2 eliminators and rev. limit extender).
Has anyone else here tried this new Dynojet unit on the 06 Dyna, and if so, were you pleased w/ the results?
 

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I don't know about pulling the O2 Sensors. Is it a step backwards or is it just an epa thing..? I am waiting to do any mods on my bike. I was at the local big dog etc custom style bike shop and he told me to run the PCIII plus they have a dyno and will tune it up for me. The local harley shop said go with the sert but no dyno. ??? I think it is what the local shop has in stock. they don't care what you put on as long as you purchase it from them.
 

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Jamiewideglide I think his screen name is has a SERT for his 06 dyna. Least he talked about it in another thread. Maybe he will chime in since he has actual hands on knowledge of it. From a post though it appears the SERT will allow fuel chart changes going in and out of closed loop. This would be far better then the PCIII elimination kit in my opinion. Also most likely the opinion of the EPA.
http://www.daytona-twintec.com/tech.html
this company also makes a complete replacement ECM with use of wideband O2 sensors.
http://www.terrycomp.com/efi_cat.html
This company is also supposed to offer a dual wideband O2 sensor set up also in the near future.

Both the Terry and Daytona set's are overkill if all you plan to do is swap pipes and air cleaners. But if cams,intake,throttle body swaps are in the future you may want to look into them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for your prompt input and links. I'm leaning toward the PCIII because of: initial cost (under $300, and I don't plan to do any dyno tuning, other than my butt dyno), O2 eliminators (so the system isn't hunting or surging looking for the correct ratio- I used to own a BMW oil head w/ a lambda sensor), open loop injection systems work fine, especially w/ all the external condition inputs, I'd like to put miles on this bike, not build it for the dyno, I like the idea of being able to pull the PCIII and plug the wires back into the O2 sensors which will return the bike to OEM, then be able to sell the PCIII if needed, I'd like to be able to make small tweeks @ cruising speed to increase my tank range, I'd like to increase the rev. limit out to 6200 rpm (the Dyna starts to get smooth @ 3000, then signs off @ 5500 rpm), the PCIII is an ECM output conditioner that lots of folks have experience with, I'd like to putz around w/ the system to see how it reacts, etc, etc. There's lots of other reasons for the other competing conditioner/ECM replacement systems, too. I'm just not in that league. As far as EPA emmisions in an open loop vs. closed loop, once the A/F is modified from OEM setting, it is most likely no longer compliant no matter what system is used (carb., open, or closed loop efi). My previous TC88 had a carb w/ a thunderslide, and it performed very well and returned terrific mileage. I feel this efi system has the potential to do even better.
 

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I went with the sert and I'm very happy. If you just want to add fuel, you can do it by altering the voltage on the O2 sensors. Real easy mod to the map. SERT was $367 from Hale's HD, so the price isn't much different than a PCIII, plus you don't have to worry about the unit failing and you are good to go for any future engine mods.

The O2 sensors are a step forward in EFI and computer controlled engine management. Yeah, HD used them to stay EPA compliant, but you can use them to make your bike run better too. Sert offers a data mode that records everything from every sensor and gives you a nice graph that shows exactly what your engine is doing and when. You can tune the engine and never get your hands greasy. Graph shows spark knock sensor activity and you can tune your timing to near perfection just from the charts.

Only advantage to a PCIII is the ability to move the unit to a different bike, but I don't plan on selling my bike any time soon, so it was a moot point.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Watch it, Jamie. You may be talking me into (out of) something. I like the idea of the data downloading. Were you able to increase the rev. limiter setting? Could you please tell me what mods you have on your Dyna and how has this SERT made an improvement for you?
You're right about the resale of the efi control unit. It's no biggie. But sometimes folks (potential customers) look at these mods and figure you've been beating/ racing the bike.
 

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dirtyduck said:
Watch it, Jamie. You may be talking me into (out of) something. I like the idea of the data downloading. Were you able to increase the rev. limiter setting? Could you please tell me what mods you have on your Dyna and how has this SERT made an improvement for you?
You're right about the resale of the efi control unit. It's no biggie. But sometimes folks (potential customers) look at these mods and figure you've been beating/ racing the bike.
Well, my aim isn't to talk you out of anything. Both units are good. For me, the sert was better. Yes, you can change the rev limiter to just about anything you want. My Dyna is a typical stage I '06 model - SEII slip ons and SE/AC with a KN filter.

So far all I've done is to bump up the voltage settings for the O2 sensors. Did this all the way across the map. This adds more fuel to the mix. I've done some data runs and I've noticed that I am not getting any spark retard anywhere - no matter the load on the engine nor the rpm. Next step will be to advance the timing a little bit, then do another data run. This should improve fuel mileage and make the bike run better. I also plan to play with the VE tables (they basically tell the ECM how much air is entering the cyl at a specific rpm) and see what happens.

No matter which unit you buy, the thing lacking is an AFR meter. That's why a dyno tune can nail everything almost perfectly. You can tinker with the sert or PCIII for a month and get your bike running a lot better, but you'll never know if it's perfect without that AFR meter.

The thing is the VE tables... Everything is based off of that. The engine is an air pump and the amount of air able to enter the combustion chamber changes with your RPMs. You can set the AFR to any setting you like, but if the VE tables aren't correct, then the mixture isn't going to equal your desired AFR setting.

So, this is why I chose the sert - The data mode recorder will allow the home tuner to get things pretty close. I don't know if the PCIII has that feature, but I know the sert does. I like to tinker and I've got some experience tuning and racing bikes, so this was right down my alley. You get data on everything, including engine temp, rpm, bike speed, O2 feedback, spark knock, timing...plus, you get data for each individual cylinder and tuning capability for each individual cylinder... pretty much everything you could ever want. It also displays everything in a graph and the numerical values.

If you just want to get a canned map from someone else's dyno run, I think the PCIII site has a bunch of them. But if you want to tune your own bike, I don't see how you can beat the sert.
 

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JamieWG said:
If you just want to get a canned map from someone else's dyno run, I think the PCIII site has a bunch of them. But if you want to tune your own bike, I don't see how you can beat the sert.
Just food for thought here... Be careful with the canned maps from the powercommander site. My build wasn't there, so I contacted them to see if there was a map I could use until I was dyno'd. They came back with a suggested map and said "you can run all day with this map and your build"... ha. My pipes blued all the way down to, and onto, the mufflers (the pipe bluing is hidden, but the muffler isnt and now my muffler looks like sh!t).
I compared the map they told me to put on, to the map after dyno'd, and the numbers were waaaayyy different. Unless they have a map for your exact build, I would stay away... regardless of what the guys from Dyno say.
It is my understanding that a "zero" map is basically a pass through... I found that out just recently, but don't know it to be fact. Since I had the stage 1 ECM download, I should have just run the damn thing with a zero map to get it to the shop.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Looks like folks are more in favor of the SERT than the PCIII. I went back to your previous posts, Jamie. Also went back to Springer's SERT intro. Very good info from both of you. Thanks. In looking over the SERT users manual, it appears to be very flexible and have more tuning parameters than the PCIII.
 

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Be aware that the lastest version of the sert manual has a section relating to your '06 Dyna and the closed loop EFI. If you are studying an older version of the manual, be sure to read the new one before tuning.
 

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not to confuse, but you may wanna look into the thundermax from zippers.ask for tony!
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
claydbal,
what is your '06 dyna set up or mods? if I got a Thundermax, I'd like to have it pre programmed close for my current set up (a/c and mufflers), and be able to do slight trim adjustments afterward.
 

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If you are making just those changes then you can get your dealer to download the new fuel map from HD for your mods and reflash the stock ECM and get a dyno run for less than the PCIII. I had my 06 Lowrider done after I added the SE intake and Cobra slip on exhaust. $250 for the download and flash including the Dyno. Runs very strong and no fooling around trying to tune the system. Plus I saw the Air Fuel mixture was spot on for the entire RPM range. They can can fix the RPM limiter as well.
 

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this was 4 years ago i think its a little late for that info....lol
 
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