V-Twin Forum banner

1 - 10 of 10 Posts

·
Just Like to Ride
Joined
·
3,242 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've been on another site - www.j-pcycles.com - going through their forum page. I've even made them aware of the problem dprice is having right now with h-d MoCo - topic Un-freakin'-believable. Lots of people on that site have complained about h-d $tealer$hip$ overcharging for their bikes and h-d MoCo responding with "We cannot control what dealerships charge for bikes because they are all independant dealers." Well, This led to another debate about 'When is a Harley Not a Harley?' in that same thread. I have an article here with that title from 'The Horse Backstreet Choppers' magazine Nov. 2001 issue.

I LOVE this part of the article(1st page):

Ms. Henslee - h-d trademark manager(I'm sure dprice knows this lady :p) - responds to Ralph Janus:

"...To begin with, it might be helpful if you understood the fundamental rationale behind trademark law, which is essentially twofold: the protection of consumers from confusion, mistake and deception caused by miuse of brand names; and the protection of the trademark owners who invest billions of to promote these band names. This latter protection is not given for free; rather TRADEMARK OWNERS ARE REQUIRED -- OBLIGATED -- IN EXCHANGE FOR THIS PROTECTION TO CONTROL THE NATURE AND QUALITY OF ALL PRODUCTS AND SERVICES IN CONNECTION WITH WHICH THEIR TRADEMARKS ARE USED."


All CAPS is me. Of course, the above article is talking about when someone builds their own bike and gets it titled as a h-d. But doesn't the above fly in face of the h-d response to everyone that "We cannot control what dealerships charge for bikes because they are all independant dealers.":rolleyes:

By the way, here is h-d criteria for a bike to be represented as a h-d. BOTH criteria must be met:
1. It must originally have been assembled in its entirety by Harley-Davidson Motor Company at either its York or Kansas City plant; and
2. It must be equipped with three critical components installed by Harley-Davidson during the motorcycle's original manufacture(or with gebuine Harley-Davidson replacement parts for these components): the frame, the crankcases, and the transmission.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,186 Posts
Well, if somebody slapped a Budweiser Lable on a bottle of piss and tried to pass it off as Budweiser, :eek: ok bad example.


Well if somebody slapped a Coors lable on a bottle of... strike that.


Hmmmmmm? :confused:

Perhaps H-D, Budweiser and Coors are afraid folks would like the imitations better?
Hell I don't know. :rolleyes:


BLA HAha ThisHarley'sForYouBudIt'sTheWater DOT HA!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,086 Posts
Nice Criteria, Unome, what it doen't mention you'll note, is how much of the actual manufacturing was done on the bike in their Mexico City plant, as long as the final assembly remains in KC or the York, PA.

At least that's better than the child labor they use overseas to make their "offically licenced 'ladies' leather thongs."
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,559 Posts
If a company with a trademark does not try to limit and protect its use, the trademark can be rescinded. Although this may seem selfserving (probably is) its a real problem for companies like Xerox and Coca Cola, who names are used generically. If they don't actively try to restrict the use of their names they will lose their exclisive (trademarked) right to the name. Not sticking up for the Motor Company, its the courts interpretations. Harley Davidson does have risk that if enough people use the Harley name generically to refer to large v twins (i.e. if a court were to beleive it) and it were demonstrated they didn't at least try to control it, they could be deemed to have abandoned their trademark, Then anyone, in theory, could sell a v twin (or an opposed twin i suppose) and label it a Harley.

The issue to me is the fine line between doing what has to be done and being a corporate asshole. Keep in mind that lawyers are making this decision, so what would you expect? Not trying to bash lawyers......, well perhaps i am.

greg
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
48 Posts
JimmyK said:
Well, if somebody slapped a Budweiser Lable on a bottle of piss and tried to pass it off as Budweiser, :eek: ok bad example.

Well, if somebody slapped a "buttwiper" lable on a bottle ofpiss and tried to pass it off as budweiser, well hell, theyd get away with it,: eek:
Well if somebody slapped a Coors lable on a bottle of... strike that.


Hmmmmmm? :confused:

Perhaps H-D, Budweiser and Coors are afraid folks would like the imitations better?
Hell I don't know. :rolleyes:


BLA HAha ThisHarley'sForYouBudIt'sTheWater DOT HA![/
B]
:)
 

·
Just bad
Joined
·
698 Posts
Registration of customs varies from state to state. In Georgia, if you have an aftermarket frame (I'm speaking to all vehicles - I don't know if any m/c frames exist without serial nos unless you roll your own) with no numbers on it, the state goes with the engine for registrations and smog requirements. If the engine happens to be H-D then that's what they call it. Now if you start manufacturing motorcycles and calling them Harleys then you're talking bigtime infringement.
 

·
Just Like to Ride
Joined
·
3,242 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
TRADEMARK OWNERS ARE REQUIRED -- OBLIGATED -- IN EXCHANGE FOR THIS PROTECTION TO CONTROL THE NATURE AND QUALITY OF ALL PRODUCTS AND SERVICES IN CONNECTION WITH WHICH THEIR TRADEMARKS ARE USED."

I understand h-d wanting to come down on someone who throws together some piece of crap with h-d parts and calls it a h-d.

Point that really sticks with me is h-d saying they have no control over dealers regarding pricing, etc. because they are all independant. Based on what Ms. Henslee said in her above statement, it would appear to me they do have some control(but just don't exercise it).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,042 Posts
DJW said:
Nice Criteria, Unome, what it doen't mention you'll note, is how much of the actual manufacturing was done on the bike in their Mexico City plant, as long as the final assembly remains in KC or the York, PA.

At least that's better than the child labor they use overseas to make their "offically licenced 'ladies' leather thongs."
I happen to like women in those thongs:D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
22,086 Posts
JFScheck said:


I happen to like women in those thongs:D
Yeah me too, but I'd like them even better if I knew they were made in textile mill in a poor part of the bronx or new orleans. For a company that crows about it's american heritage, they could do a lot more to support the very people that created them. I know that it's a world economy, but I doubt that you'll see too many new harley's driving down the dusty roads of indoneisa. Sometimes I have trouble telling the MOCO and Walmart apart.
 
1 - 10 of 10 Posts
Top