[SCHOONER1]

Well Guys I'M DONE FOR ~ +SMSH+


After taken all the body parts off the bike myself and having the bike custom painted. After locating and buying missing screws/bolts/etc,etc. Going back and forward to HomeDepot/Lowes
and all the rest ~ I'M DONE !!!

Its true I haven't started the bike in about four (4) yrs. do to a little thing called CANCER of the kidney and some other parts they took out. I've recovered well SO-FAR.

Now here's what happened:

In the back of my mind I'm wondering if the PISTONS ARE CEASED after all this time of not starting her-up.

I would check on the bike on our back patio and notice an oil leak from under the bike. Not having the strength to do anything about it; I let it lay.

Little do I know at the time the OIL was leaking from a oil breather I had installed many,many years ago and for what reason I cant remember. Lets not forget I bought the my Electra Glide Classic brand new in 1985.

O.k. I'm ready to have the bike re-painted. Still wondering if the bike is going to start.

The bike had no oil due to the constant leaking thru the years coming from that DARN OIL BREATHER. I put new oil and oil filter on the bike.

How I tested if the pistons would turn I did this:

Got a wire coat hanger and straighten it out and made it to come out of the spart plug hole about 3ins. I put tape right at the beginning of the hole where the wire hanger rested.So I could tell if the rear piston moved up and down. I jack-up the rear wheel and put the bike in gear and hit the starter. And LOW AND BEHOLD THE WIRE MOVED UP - INDICATION THE REAR PISTON

IS NOT CEASED. I didn't test for the front piston figuring if the rear one move I'd be O.K. ~ and GOD said, " YEAH RIGHT

Now I thought I was home free ~ WRONG

I put the spark plugs back and pumped the throttle a bit and I hit the starter.

Well the engine made the rrrrr sound and then came THE KNOCKING
AND the knocking. Not being a motorcycle mechanic I know I was in trouble.

Little did I know as I was trying to start her up; My wife yelled out to my from the livingroom; " Honey there's OIL COMING OUT OF THE BIKE "

I stopped hiting the starter and look-over the right side of the bike on the patio floor was: LOOK AT THE PHOTOS.

I need your imput guys; I know its bad but I don't know how bad.The start works, got a brand new battery in there, new oil and filter like I said.

Really Dumb Question To Ask: What is causing that KNOCKING.

Remember the rear pistons did go up and down. Why wouldn't the front piston move ALSO

After ALL that work !

I'M DONE, FINISHED & DEPRESSED !!!

O.K. guys I'm in your hands tell me what you think ?

 

[Advanced76]

The oil leaked passed the check valve and filled up the bottom end. When you try to start it it forces the oil out the breather. Its probably knocking cause all the oil is in the bottom end not in the tank (nor the system) check the oil level. It will probably run for a while after you get it all figured out. My brother bought a 92 with less than 5000 miles on it last year. Put 30 on it before any major problems. If the rear piston moves up and down and the front one doesnt, thats catastrophic. i dont even think its possible, really. You'd have to break a piston pin, or a rod. Good luck!

 

[SCHOONER1]

What You Said Makes Lot Of CENTS $ $ $



Hey jammerx

Thank you for you imput. What you said makes lot of sense and can save me lot of CENTS ~ GOD willing.

So what your saying is:
Check the oil tank and see how much new oil is still in the tank. You
know what you said about starter forced out the old oil: now that I think about it that oil on the patio floor is OLK DIRTY LOOKING OIL

So what your saying is try starting it again
The old oil is not leaking out anymore.

I'll wait till I hear from you or anyother of the guys on this GREAT FOURM

The oil leaked passed the check valve and filled up the bottom end. When you try to start it it forces the oil out the breather. Its probably knocking cause all the oil is in the bottom end not in the tank (nor the system) check the oil level. It will probably run for a while after you get it all figured out. My brother bought a 92 with less than 5000 miles on it last year. Put 30 on it before any major problems. If the rear piston moves up and down and the front one doesnt, thats catastrophic. i dont even think its possible, really. You'd have to break a piston pin, or a rod. Good luck!

 

[K9r]

Before you try and fire it up again you might want to take out the spark plugs (ground the plug wires to the head to keep from damaging the ignition ) take off the breather filter and crank the engine to see if you can push any more oil out.

 

[SCHOONER1]

Just how do i do that

Hi K9r

Just how do I ground out the spark plug wires
As far as the oil breather is concern I don't think that is necessary due to the fact that ALL the old oil is OUT of both the crank and oil breather.

I wonder though if I should take the new oil filter off the bike and then after you tell me how to ground out the spark plug wires I crank it up again.

However, from what I'm reading the CHECK BALL IN THE OIL PUMP JUST MIGHT BE STUCK ALSO

I got a BANGING noise from the engine. Guys telling me no oil is getting to the topend that's why the noise

Before you try and fire it up again you might want to take out the spark plugs (ground the plug wires to the head to keep from damaging the ignition ) take off the breather filter and crank the engine to see if you can push any more oil out.

 

[Advanced76]

Hey jammerx

Thank you for you imput. What you said makes lot of sense and can save me lot of CENTS ~ GOD willing.

So what your saying is:
Check the oil tank and see how much new oil is still in the tank. You
know what you said about starter forced out the old oil: now that I think about it that oil on the patio floor is OLK DIRTY LOOKING OIL

So what your saying is try starting it again
The old oil is not leaking out anymore.

I'll wait till I hear from you or anyother of the guys on this GREAT FOURM

Yes check the oil in the tank. Check ball is probably not stuck open, the oil just seeped thru... Add oil to tank, remove plugs and just turn engine over. Have a catch pan under breather to catch oil being blown out the breather. After oil stops coming out the breather, button it up and fire her off and see what happens...

 

[K9r]

Easy way to ground is to put the plugs back in the cables and then lay the spark plug on the valve cover away from the spark plug hole (just in case you pump any fuel/air mix out ) as long as metal touches metal should be good to go.
Jammerx def. has you going in the right direction. As far as the banging goes it could have been from all of the oil in the crank case ,basicaly turning the engine into a hydraulic pump forcing the oil out the breather. Good luck

 

[SCHOONER1]

The Problems NEVER stop with this Harley of mine

Hey K9r

This might take awhile trying to explain what's going on with my heartpain Harley.

I replaced the spring in the oil pump check ball side. Took the check ball out with magnet and its in GREAT SHAPE. Checked the hole in the check ball oil pump for metal filings ~ found it CLEAN.

I put everything back and put a pan under the oil breather just in case the bike wanted to blow out oil thru the oil breather i would catch it.

O.K. I turn the bike on and had in natural and hit the starter and got G-G-R-R-R-R-R not banging just wouldn't start. I looked down where the pan was under the oil breather and NO OIL.

BUT THE BIKE JUST WOULDN'T.

I walked away. Later tonight Aug 25th I figure I go out and take the spark plugs out to see what the gap was.

And low and behold their was FRIGHEN NEW OIL on the patio floor. But this time is wasn't in the pan I still had under the bike. The oil spot about 12 - 15ins circle was more up front under the bike. I got down on my hands and knees to look where the HELL the oil came from ? Couldn't tell, not YET anyway.

It wasn't a lot ~ but it was CLEAN OIL I put in the oil tank a couple of days ago. Hummm ! What the heck is going on. I don't think its coming from the new oil filter I just put in.

O.K. from my stupid non-H-D mechanic mind I know this:
The new oil didn't come out of the oil breather.
Pressure built up while I was trying to start the bike earlier this afternoon. But where did it come from. Tomorrow will probably tell the tale.

AREN'T YOU SO GLAD YOU ASKED THIS DUMMY #[email protected]
Tell me my good man what do you think of all this
And the DRAMA continues :dh:

Easy way to ground is to put the plugs back in the cables and then lay the spark plug on the valve cover away from the spark plug hole (just in case you pump any fuel/air mix out ) as long as metal touches metal should be good to go.
Jammerx def. has you going in the right direction. As far as the banging goes it could have been from all of the oil in the crank case ,basicaly turning the engine into a hydraulic pump forcing the oil out the breather. Good luck

 

[FLTRSE3CLONE]

not trying to be a smartass but are you sure you drained the oil pan & not the trans? could the bike be way over full?

 

[K9r]

When you removed the check ball any oil leak out ? When I've replaced pressure relief springs oil that leaked out found it's way around the pump body and dripped from the bottom of the crank case.
A fellow once told me oil is like blood even a small amount looks serious.(Espicialy when it's under your bike)
As far as the "Grrrrrr" how's the charge on the battery? Good luck.

 

[SCHOONER1]

Battery Is Brand New

Hey K9r

Thanks 4 your questions and suggestions.

When I took the oil pump large screw off NO OIL CAME RUNING OUT.
I replaced the spring and inspected the CHECK BALL its was in GREAT CONDTION. I put it back tightened everything up and good to go.

Why the battery died I forgot to turn the ignition off when my wife called out to me to go to the Harley shop to pick-up some parts I had back ordered.

Of course as you very well know when I guys like me (70yrs.ol'guy)
hears HARLEY SHOP ~ I FORGET EVERYTHING . . . :redrolf:

That's it my man ~ and the saga continues until I get that baby in the wind with me on it :beatdh:

When you removed the check ball any oil leak out ? When I've replaced pressure relief springs oil that leaked out found it's way around the pump body and dripped from the bottom of the crank case.
A fellow once told me oil is like blood even a small amount looks serious.(Espicialy when it's under your bike)
As far as the "Grrrrrr" how's the charge on the battery? Good luck.

 

[Dan89FLSTC]

Before you try and fire it up again you might want to take out the spark plugs (ground the plug wires to the head to keep from damaging the ignition ) take off the breather filter and crank the engine to see if you can push any more oil out.

This bike does not have the modern starter setup , which came out in `89, it has the old system like the Shovelheads did. It needs the compression in order to disengage the starter solenoid. If you crank without the plugs, or with a weak battery, it is possible that it will continue to crank even after the starter button is released.

not trying to be a smartass but are you sure you drained the oil pan & not the trans? could the bike be way over full?

This bike does not have an oil pan…it has an oil tank.

Schooner, I suggest that you again remove the check ball, and fill that cavity with oil in order to prime the pump.

You can also remove the ball and just wait until the oil comes down through the pump from the tank, it will take a few minutes. Then put it back together and start it up.

If it still clatters, repeat the process.

Oil will come out the breather hose for a while, just put a pan underneath.

I also suggest that once you get the bike running, that you re-route the breather hose so that it goes back from the engine toward the rear, keeping it outboard as much as possible so that any oil that might drip out will not go in front of the rear tire.

And get rid of that filter on the breather hose, it does no good other than get nasty looking. Nothing is going to to up that hose into the engine.

 

[SCHOONER1]

Thanks For Your Suggestions ~ However . . .

Hi Dan89FLSTC

The bike is starting; no oil coming anywhere.

However, she starts but then after about 30 seconds she dies.

I wonder because I have a hose connection under the carb that I DON'T KNOW WHERE IN GOES #[email protected]

Take a look at the photo(s) mayber you can tell me. And maybe that's why the bike dies.

This bike does not have the modern starter setup , which came out in `89, it has the old system like the Shovelheads did. It needs the compression in order to disengage the starter solenoid. If you crank without the plugs, or with a weak battery, it is possible that it will continue to crank even after the starter button is released.



This bike does not have an oil pan…it has an oil tank.

Schooner, I suggest that you again remove the check ball, and fill that cavity with oil in order to prime the pump.

You can also remove the ball and just wait until the oil comes down through the pump from the tank, it will take a few minutes. Then put it back together and start it up.

If it still clatters, repeat the process.

Oil will come out the breather hose for a while, just put a pan underneath.

I also suggest that once you get the bike running, that you re-route the breather hose so that it goes back from the engine toward the rear, keeping it outboard as much as possible so that any oil that might drip out will not go in front of the rear tire.

And get rid of that filter on the breather hose, it does no good other than get nasty looking. Nothing is going to to up that hose into the engine.

 

[Dan89FLSTC]

However, she starts but then after about 30 seconds she dies.

I wonder because I have a hose connection under the carb that I DON'T KNOW WHERE IN GOES

The hose that is missing is a drain hose, in case the carburetor overfills. It is not the reason you engine quits.

You may want to remove the float bowl from the carb and clean it out, there is a good chance that while sitting for so long, the old gas has gummed up and clogged some of the jets or passageways. You may have to completely dissemble the carb to get it clean. If you need an overhaul kit for the carb, you can get one from J&P cycles, or Johns Motorcycle Parts.

The carb you have is a Keihin Butterfly carb.

 

[SCHOONER1]

I Did Re-Build The Carb As Best I Could . . .

Hey Dan89FLSTC

Dan I did clean the carb bowel out and replaced all that I could with the carb rebuilding kit I bought.

One thing if you LOOK @ the photo from way up in the carb is that BLACK RUBBER SEAL WITH THE BRASS IN IT ~ DAN IS THAT IN THE IN THE RIGHT WAY YES/NO

The bike starts but for only about 30 secs. or so.
Then it DIES.
That KEIHIN CARB that came with the bike when I bought it new isn't worth the power to blow to you know where :hystria:

Like I said the bike starts; I got the choke out just a bit; my hand is OFF THE THOTTLE. She starts to cough/fart/snezz with a little white puff of smoke just for me.

Then she starts to DIE on me; I hit the throttle right away and she revs up; just for again about 30 secs or so and then DIES

Dan I don't know what the heck is goin' on #[email protected]

From the little I know about engines it seems to me a FUEL PROBLEM or CARB PROBLEM ~ YOU TELL ME DAN :clap:

The hose that is missing is a drain hose, in case the carburetor overfills. It is not the reason you engine quits.

You may want to remove the float bowl from the carb and clean it out, there is a good chance that while sitting for so long, the old gas has gummed up and clogged some of the jets or passageways. You may have to completely dissemble the carb to get it clean. If you need an overhaul kit for the carb, you can get one from J&P cycles, or Johns Motorcycle Parts.

The carb you have is a Keihin Butterfly carb.

 

[Dan89FLSTC]

Schooner, your accelerator pump looks like it is in good shape, in fact, that is why your engine runs when you twist the throttle.

The accelerator pump squirts fuel into the carb throat, but when that fuel is burned, the engine quits, probably because you have a clogged idle jet.

The idle jet on that carb is located on the top, toward the rear, you can see three ports sticking out of the top of the carb in your picture, it is the one in the center between the brass vacuum hose adapter and the black cover angling toward the left .

It may have an aluminum plug covering it so that it can`t be tampered with (due to EPA regulations), but that plug can be removed easily by drilling a hole in it with a 1/8" drill bit, and then use a pick or awl to lever the plug out. Be careful if you have to drill, do not go any deeper than the thickness of the plug.

Once the plug is out of the way, unscrew the idle jet, be careful because there is a small washer, a spring and an o ring inside.

Once the tiny parts are safely removed, clean out that passageway with carb cleaner.

When you re install the jet, turn it in gently until it stops.

Then back it out about 1-1/2 turns.

 

[SCHOONER1]

WOW ! That's Pretty Tale Order My Man

Hey Dan89FLSTC

Hey that's a pretty order getting in the carb; disconnecting the unit putting on a bench. If I have too I will.

If you look at these plug after I tried to start the again again and again this is the way the plugs look.

So I bought new ones and I'll see what happens after tomorrow with the new plugs in her.

Those upper upper jets - the one in the middle just how to clean it. I believe with Q-tips or small piece of wire I guess.

Tell me what you think why this bike of mine does START :dh:

Schooner, your accelerator pump looks like it is in good shape, in fact, that is why your engine runs when you twist the throttle.

The accelerator pump squirts fuel into the carb throat, but when that fuel is burned, the engine quits, probably because you have a clogged idle jet.

The idle jet on that carb is located on the top, toward the rear, you can see three ports sticking out of the top of the carb in your picture, it is the one in the center between the brass vacuum hose adapter and the black cover angling toward the left .

It may have an aluminum plug covering it so that it can`t be tampered with (due to EPA regulations), but that plug can be removed easily by drilling a hole in it with a 1/8" drill bit, and then use a pick or awl to lever the plug out. Be careful if you have to drill, do not go any deeper than the thickness of the plug.

Once the plug is out of the way, unscrew the idle jet, be careful because there is a small washer, a spring and an o ring inside.

Once the tiny parts are safely removed, clean out that passageway with carb cleaner.

When you re install the jet, turn it in gently until it stops.

Then back it out about 1-1/2 turns.

 

[bigbadal]

I'm glad you are feeling well enough to do all this after your cancer episode. I hope you are totally over that disease.

This is a step by step process. One step at a time and you will get that bike running again. Just follow Dan's advice and instructions. Also, get the HD manual, it is invaluable! Lord willing, you will be on your way before the snow flies.

 

[kustom_flames]

Whatever happened with this? I know the new ethanol gas can really screw up your carb...did mine. After a short period of time the gas also basically turned into turpentine and you it wouldn't even ignite. Dumb question, but you are using fresh gas right? I had a similar problem in my 65 chevy where I didn't use a stabilizer over the winter and then started it up in the spring. It started the first few days then afterwards that gas would not ignite. I was getting plenty of gas to the carbs....just wouldn't burn. Drained the tank and with some fresh gas fired right up...