[nutdriverss]

I was woundering if the new Victorys were having the same issues with heat due to EPA regs. Are they equiped with CATS? Being air cooled I would think they are heat up as well.

 

[LowRiderCustom]

Victory motors are air and oil cooled so overheating isn't a problem.

 

[nutdriverss]

So are Harleys.

 

[LowRiderCustom]

Harleys aren't oil cooled unless an oil cooler is installed.

 

[Cross Roads]

No heat issues.

Bikes run lean from factory, but disconnecting the O² sensors is a 30 second procedure allowing them to run a bit richer and even cooler.

 

[joeschmoe]

Plus the Victory's run their oil pressure at 80 psi at idle not 2 psiI like HD. Which allows better removal of the heat that builds up in the motor, gets it cooler quicker...

Yep an oil cooler is optional on a HD and stock on a Vic....Helps a lot!! :woohoo:

 

[strokerjlk]

No heat issues.

Bikes run lean from factory, but disconnecting the O² sensors is a 30 second procedure allowing them to run a bit richer and even cooler.

please explain

 

[smitty901]

Harleys aren't oil cooled unless an oil cooler is installed.

I am 100% HD.
But only 1 HD has Oil cooled heads and that is a 1200. All the oil coolers in the world will not coll HD heads any more than they are with out one.
The small amount of oil that flow to the heads is for lube and carriers so little heat awy it is not worth even looking at.
Second take a trip to A victory shop you will hear some terms you are use to hearing.
Stage1, tuner, DYNO ect they have there EPA issue also.

 

[joeschmoe]

I am 100% HD.
But only 1 HD has Oil cooled heads and that is a 1200. All the oil coolers in the world will not coll HD heads any more than they are with out one.
The small amount of oil that flow to the heads is for lube and carriers so little heat awy it is not worth even looking at.
Second take a trip to A victory shop you will hear some terms you are use to hearing.
Stage1, tuner, DYNO ect they have there EPA issue also.

To clarify your statement regarding the above:

Stage 1 is for a different exhaust note, nothing else. Tuner is to add fuel once a set of cams are put in, no one adds a fueler to a stock Vic cause you just don't need it...You dyno a Vic to see what the $1500 dollar cams did to bump up performance, usually it is in the range of 27% but some see up to 30% improvement in HP and torque...

So let's be clear, yes every manufacturer is feeling issues from the EPA tards, but Victory dealt with them BEFORE the desisgned the motor not afterwards...

All you are referring to are mods not anything to do with EPS BS

 

[Bowtie18]

Plus the Victory's run their oil pressure at 80 psi at idle not 2 psiI like HD. Which allows better removal of the heat that builds up in the motor, gets it cooler quicker...

Yep an oil cooler is optional on a HD and stock on a Vic....Helps a lot!! :woohoo:

Actually, oil coolers are standard on all the HD's with 103's, which is most of the big twin line, other than the Supergide and Street bob. OF course, the V-rods are water cooled.

That just leaves the Sportster line, other than the two Dynas mentioned above, without oil coolers.


The oil pressure deal is dead on however. Really, 80 PSI at idle? Interesting!

 

[Z16Monte]

Plus the Victory's run their oil pressure at 80 psi at idle not 2 psiI like HD. Which allows better removal of the heat that builds up in the motor, gets it cooler quicker...

Yep an oil cooler is optional on a HD and stock on a Vic....Helps a lot!! :woohoo:

Oil removes the same amount of heat at 2 psi as at 80psi. It's non compressable so the as long as the volume remains the same, heat removal remains the same. Now, upping the volume of oil pumped through the system can increase heat removal.
Ed

 

[BoomerBob]

To clarify your statement regarding the above:

Stage 1 is for a different exhaust note, nothing else. Tuner is to add fuel once a set of cams are put in, no one adds a fueler to a stock Vic cause you just don't need it...You dyno a Vic to see what the $1500 dollar cams did to bump up performance, usually it is in the range of 27% but some see up to 30% improvement in HP and torque...

So let's be clear, yes every manufacturer is feeling issues from the EPA tards, but Victory dealt with them BEFORE the desisgned the motor not afterwards...

All you are referring to are mods not anything to do with EPS BS

Oddly enough; the new Freedom motors run a bit hotter than previous models. The Vic's were designed to be oil over air cooled so oil flow to and from the heads reflect that design. On earlier models the oil cooler was too big and actually over cooled the motor. Now they look like a standard HD oil cooler.

Btw; I paid $520 for my Lloydz cams, dropped them in myself, and tuned it with the PCV w/Auto Tune and it runs fantastic. Haven't done a dyno test on it yet but it should be in the 110/110 neighborhood. Again, because of the motor design, maximum benefit can be had with this simple cam change which are overhead cams - one per head. I even used the same gaskets just to see what would happen and everything is fine. No leaks at all.

I did the poor man Stage 1 and ran it that way for about a year before doing the cams and a re-cored set of mufflers though. It simply consisted of changing the air filter to a high flow style (K&N), pulling the sound gasket under the tank for more air flow, drilling out the plate in the mufflers with a 1- 1/8th hole saw and disconnecting the O2 sensors which puts the AFR Target into 13.5-13.8. The ECM did the rest by adjusting for elevation, heat, etc. Cost was about $30. I got the re-cored mufflers later for about $200 for better sound and a boost in torque; especially at the lower rpm range. The cams finished that boost in low end torque but really shines above 2800 with a really strong pull all the way to red line.

Probably the most significant difference in todays Freedom motor and HD' big twin is the Big Twin, because of crankshaft production design, can handle around 100/100 hp/tq before needing to be pulled, trued, and welded. Most that can afford it opt for the Jim's crank and wheels from what I've been reading. Then the top end can be built on up to ???. The Vic Freedom motor is designed to handle 140/140 hp/tq right out of the factory so bumping up the top end is no problem. The starter can even handle the big bore upgrades. The clutch will likely need a boost though. Lloydz makes a variable speed clutch plate for around $400 that should take care of that. If the bike has some miles on it; a switch to the Barnett Plates and Disks wouldn't hurt none while you're in there.

 

[Half_crazy]

There is a difference between an engine that was designed to be air/oil cooled and adding an oil cooler to an air-cooled engine. To be honest, the EPA is killing all the manufacturers... but Harley has a harder time meeting emissions while keeping performance and without overheating. The disadvantage of being a slave to tradition.

In discussing the performance differences, the biggest factor in Victory's favor is their 4-valve heads. The design allows high air velocity through the ports AND high overall flow as well. The engine can make killer low end grunt while still having strong horsepower at high rpm. Less airflow compromises and smaller valves are easier to control.

Strength?

HD Crank...

Victory Crank...

The Vic Crank is designed like an automotive engine where the crank is one-piece and the rods bolt together on the crank pin. This precludes having the jugs line up one behind the other, but it would be physically impossible to scissor a Victory crankshaft.

 

[Half_crazy]

On earlier models the oil cooler was too big and actually over cooled the motor.

The V-92 "Hammer" engine also held 6 quarts of oil. Between that and the huge oil cooler, if you put a good synthetic oil in it and the temps were below 60 degrees the engine would never reach full operating temperature while the bike was in motion...

The Freedom engines now hold a little less than 5 quarts in addition to the reduced size of the oil cooler.

 

[BoomerBob]

I never looked at the crank that close and didn't realize the rods are offset like that. Also good to know the wheels can't scissor too.

Which cylinder is to the left?

 

[Tequila SG]

Actually, oil coolers are standard on all the HD's with 103's, which is most of the big twin line, other than the Supergide and Street bob. OF course, the V-rods are water cooled.

That just leaves the Sportster line, other than the two Dynas mentioned above, without oil coolers.


The oil pressure deal is dead on however. Really, 80 PSI at idle? Interesting!

+1 I like to see that wonder pump, 80psi at idle

 

[Half_crazy]

I never looked at the crank that close and didn't realize the rods are offset like that. Also good to know the wheels can't scissor too. Which cylinder is to the left?

Front to the right, rear to the left.

 

[Rollin']

When it get's hot, just ride faster!

Leaving Nashville - 103 degrees.

 

[Scooter66]

Oddly enough; the new Freedom motors run a bit hotter than previous models. The Vic's were designed to be oil over air cooled so oil flow to and from the heads reflect that design. On earlier models the oil cooler was too big and actually over cooled the motor. Now they look like a standard HD oil cooler.



.I definately found this to be true. I test rode some 2011 Visions and the 2012 Cross country tour and was surprised at the amount of heat the engine was throwing back. The dealer was touting how much cooler and more efficient the Vic was at diisipating the heat over a HD but not that I could tell. I would say they ran as hot as the HD.

 

[66xlch]

I also had a test ride on a Victory CC. The heat was just as bad as the Harley, If not hotter. It is a ok bike, i just like the Harley better.