[Irondon]

Hello All,

Been hangin' around this forum for sometime now and have learned alot. It is just my wish that I could have contributed more up to this point but due to limited knowledge on anything mechanical; there was just always alot more to learn than there was to share.

This is my first hog (was on the list for a FLSTSI since last July). I had the stage 1 recal done, added a hypercharger (looks+ K&N) and Vance and Hines slip ons installed, all work done by dealer. The problem is that the engine light comes on once the engine has ran for a while, when the bike gets REALLY HOT, (long stoplight), the light seems to go off- sometimes. The dealer has been doubletalking me since the paperwork was filled . He said that the bike did it before it was picked up and he reset it and now says light activates because the hypercharger was added the trap opening and closing is causing the efi to pick up strange signals due to vaccum fluctuations. He said since the bike is running ok there is no real problem, just bring the bike in and he will just disconnect the traps or just learn to live with the light.

Is the dealer telling me the truth this is no big problem, or do you think that he is covering up something? Is there another solution, would something like a powercommander help make this problem go away.

Thanx

 

[HIPPO]

One way to find out. Let him disconnect the thing. If you have to have the hypercharger for looks it's usually best to remove the fake throttle plate assembly anyway. If the symphtom doesn't go away he is out of stories and will have to scan the bike for codes.

 

[Irondon]

Thanx Hippo...

I was thinking on taking him up on that. Anything else I should have him look for. The bike has less than 50 miles on it, am I damaging the bike by riding it like this?

 

[HIPPO]

I wouldn't worry about it, but still have them look at it. If the lite comes on now and then it's bound to leave a code in the ECM. They are quite finicky, all it takes is a monitored value to be a little out of spec and the light will come on, but they should correct whatever it is on a new bike.

 

[Irondon]

Thanx again Hippo, you da man!!!

My mind is at ease... somewhat. I just get very anxious and paranoid whenever a (check) engine lite comes on, especially when it is new. I like lemonade but hate lemons.

Don

 

[Irondon]

Hey Hippo,

I took you up on your advice and brought the bike in yesterday. I also called Kuryakn and spoke to Owen who was very helpful. Owen called up my dealership ,the service manager wasn't in today so he spoke to one of the techs. The bottom line is that the bike probably wasn't mapped right. It is really odd because I asked the manager if PCIII would help the condition and he said, "no." However, I really get the feeling that all parties are trying to help all the while saving face.

I'll post when I hear anything else. In the meanwhile are there any other things that come to mind that should get brought up?

 

[HIPPO]

No problem, they probably retrieved the code and corrected whatever it was. It used to happen now and then that a reflash wouldn't take properly, so it is possible that was the case.

 

[Irondon]

Hippo,

Kuryakn has spoken to the dealership and there still is no definitive answer. It appears that both of them now agree that a PCIII would be the fix needed. What the F*@&... More parts+more labor= $$$ out of my pocket. Do I really need this addition on top of the stage 1 to get this bike to stop running so lean? Is there another way around this that won't flatten my wallet?

Don

 

[HIPPO]

Correct me if I don't understand you.
First you say that you had a problem with the engine lite coming on.
Eventually you take the bike in and you say they told you that the bike was probably mapped wrong.

That sounded like the problem was corrected.
One would imagine that if it was mapped wrong it was corrected.

Are you now saying the engine lite still comes on?


If it is, then there is some sort of discrepancy or fault in the bike. End of story.


The only way the Hypercharger can cause the lite to come on is if there is a vacuum leak caused by it, either by how it is hooked up or because it is defective and has a leak in the actuator.

The ECM can detect a vacuum leak indirectly because eventually the ISC will not be able to compensate and be out of range, but there is no way for the ECM to detect lean or rich mixture for the simple reason that it is not a monitored item, even if the thing were cooking itself to death.

A PCIIIr can only alter fuel mixture and ignition timing, and is downstream from the ECM, so I fail to see how it can correct the problem with the light coming on.
It may well be that it could somehow mask the symphtom, but it can't correct the specific problem.

They need to find out what is causing the light to come on, ie the meaning of the code it is setting, and if it not setting a code it could be a connection somewhere.
Sometimes this stuff is hard to catch on particular on Delphi bikes, and it would not be unheard of the thing correcting itself, but it is very hard to give an opinion without first hand and completely accurate information, which you are more likely to get from the actual guy working on the bike then any manager type, even if it is a "I don't know", or the 5 digit alphanumeric code it is setting.

 

[Irondon]

A man's gotta do what a man's gotta do...

Hippo and Highrider,

I first want to say THANK YOU. If one good thing has come out of this whole fiasco it is that I have found people that actually care about what is going on with this bike besides my fiancee and myself.

The bike is still in the (dealership?). When I spoke to one of the service managers he made it sound like the jury was still out. There is just that fleeting feeling of doom in the air, and no true sense of hope after our conversation. Talking to Kurakyn just confirmed my original gut feeling- that things were done half assed. It is definitely not my intention to burn bridges- but this situation has got to be resolved. I know that Pappa Harley can't be counted on this one because of the aftermarket products that were added; eventhough the 5 yr. warrantee was purchased. This is potentially going to be a long, drawn out, uphill battle. Thankfully you guys have armed me with the information needed.

Don

 

[HIPPO]

Doesn't need to be. Takes 10 minutes to take the Hypercharger off, which THEY put on. It's either it or the bike.
No point in getting excited, even a dealer can't argue with facts, once they get the drift that not fixing the bike will be more inconvenient for them then fixing it, they will fix it.

 

[Irondon]

Update

Hey Hippo,

I took the time yesterday to go down to the dealership and spoke with both the tech and service manager. Codes have been run on the bike and there is no "constant code". The code(s) that do come up point to a valve leak at the manifold. During the installation of the hypercharger a hole had to be drilled in the oem manifold to operate the butterflies via throttle- thus causing the leak. One fix that was suggested was to replace the manifold and reinstall the hypercharger minus the butterflies and hose that needed the hole drilled.

I even grasped at straws and asked if doing a stage 2 recal would help (richen mixture) and the manager said, "no that would foul plugs." He also admitted that I did not need the PCIIIr whatsoever at this point.

Hippo what should I do at this point; do I take it to another dealership, get the bike checked and have the original dealer do the work? Or is it just nothing to worry about and I am overreacting?

What would you do?

Don

 

[HIPPO]

I told you that at the beginning. Shitcan the butterflies.

Have them put a new manifold on, they really should know better, so let them eat it.

 

[HIPPO]

A different dealer will rightfully tell you to take a hike.

 

[Irondon]

Thanks...


Once again Hippo you have come thru. I guess that I was trying to see if there was another way around and still keep the butterflies. Hopefully, down the road something will be made that will help the situation for now it looks like no butterflies for me.


You still da man....

Don

 

[skydoc]

I just came across this thread Irondon. I also own a 2002 FLSTSI and had the stage 1 done and changed to Vance & Hines straight shots. I didn't have a hypercharger installed, so right away I suspected that is where your problem was as I first started reading. Once again Hippo was all over it as usual. He is a wealth of knowldge. The further I read down the thread I found out that you guys pretty much gt it resolved. This is my first EFI, so I'm a little lost without a carb and that computer chip stuff well... Anyway, hope your up and running soon. By the way, I'm originally from Long Island, Nassau County, and had cousins that lived in Brooklyn. Good hearing from you. I've been in the Army for the past 26+ years, so I haven't been to New York in in about 10 years. I'm sure its changed a bit.

 

[Irondon]

Howdy Skydoc

Great minds do think alike... Love what you have done with your pipes. I am a little more conservative and just went with the mufflers.

Anyhow, I picked up the bike today and had them disconnect the butterflies. The bike is still coding, called right away and was told to bring the bike in on Monday. The weather here today was nice and now have over 110 on the clock (should have been more, perhaps monyana?).

The funny thing about New York is that the more it changes the more it stays the same. Welcome back!!!

The saga continues...

Don

 

[Irondon]

Update

Hippo, Highrider and Skydoc,

Once again, thanks for being patient and letting me bend your ear a little. This forum has been very therapeutic.

Went along with everything that the dealer recommended as a fix. Finally just went with the Screamin Eagle A/C (got credited the difference). I start down the road from the dealership and notice that the engine light is on once again.LOL. It seems like I just can't win on this one. Took the bike right back, and the tech takes the seat off and plugs the bike into the handheld computer/scanner. Now the code for TSSM or TSM comes up and he tells me that it has something to do with the alarm. He said that it would be no problem to take the bike and bring it in on Monday. The ride that was planned for the weekend was shot to pieces.
I just hope and pray that I am nearing the light at the end of the tunnel on this one and finally get to start enjoying what I paid for.

Am I going crazy, or do these things happen to others besides myself?
I'll keep you posted.

Don

 

[HIPPO]

Well, once you start messing with these new bikes, it is pretty easy to cause a code form one area of the bike while working on and diagnosing another.

At this point there isn't much you can do, so might as well ride the sumbitch and tell them where to pick it up if it croaks.

 

[Irondon]

At this point there isn't much you can do, so might as well ride the sumbitch and tell them where to pick it up if it croaks.

ROTFLMAO

DON