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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
This Fatboy began life as an '05 "Special" 15th Anniversary Model - 95" motor. I had a Denver area shop do the rebuild this fall. After about 1k break-in miles in southern AZ, I had a reputable Phoenix tuner do his thing. I suppose I shouldn't complain too much because it really feels great, and sounds like a mean mutha! But, I have to admit I expected slightly higher numbers, around 105 or so HP, and 110 torque. Comments are of course appreciated.
 

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fatty,
Don't expect too much HP out of the 6H, that is a TQ cam all the way. And you really aren't too far off on the TQ either, although you probably should have cracked into the 110 mark. Hope you're using the standard baffle for the Propipe, and when you get a few more miles you may gain a couple of ponies and pounds. Not bad at all and it sure looks like the tuner worked it from the initial run pretty well. In short, don't sweat a few points on the dyno, you won't feel the small differences anyway. Enjoy!
 

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Yes, But.........

05fatty said:
you should be able to click on the dyno thumbnail to enlarge it. Nick at Custom Performance did the tuning.
He is not orange.........:huh:
 

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Discussion Starter #7 (Edited)
GRock,

thanks for your words of encouragement. You might recall a related discussion on this engine build I posted in the EFI Map forum.
http://www.v-twinforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=65789
You had a great insight to the problem I was having. Your reply was:

"The high lift, short duration of the cam in combination with the Baisley high velocity heads and high scavenge rate of the VH pipe can wreak havoc with the ECU tables (especially idle and low speed running) that the PCIII simply cannot correct with just fuel and timing. I can almost guarantee that the IAC is not open enough at idle (rough and uneven, right?) to compensate for the air needed by the heads and cam. And it takes a couple of seconds to get open enough after you hit the throttle to allow the engine to "clear" the sputter. As the throttle blade opens you now get the air you need and it runs better. Right?"

I switched to a SERT when I had it dyno tuned and figured between the SERT and a good tuner the sputtering would be gone. Boy was I wrong. Idle is still a little rough and the sputtering is STILL exactly as it was. The tuner I used in Phoenix was highly recommended by a couple of people, but he said the sputtering was caused by the cam...??? I emailed Bob Wood about his TW6-HG cam. He said..."The air fuel is off and dropping the rear cylinder. This is caused by lack of back pressure on your pro pipe." Bob suggested I block a couple of rows of holes in the Propipe baffle. I tried this and varied it from 1 to 2 rows...again, no improvement (in fact, the more rows that were blocked the worse it idled and sputtered). And FYI, when I pulled that baffle the first time it was very black and sooty, as well as every time I pulled it to change the configuration of the hose clamps.

edited: So, back to your original thoughts on the problem. It sounds like you're saying it can be addressed via the SERT. Unfortunately, I'm just learning SERT at this point; read springer's post on explaining the SERT and have looked at various tables, etc. using the tuning file the tuner gave me. I've looked at the IAC table, if this is what you're referring to. Where do I go from here (aside from the most obvious answer---a DIFFERENT qualified SERT tuner.

Thanks...Ed
 

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You know that's got to be a fun ride! Did you use a .03 Cometic Head gasket? If not, my guess is that's where you gave away some performance. Still I think if you're not looking at numbers and just enjoying the ride, you have a great build.

Last questions: Were the heads decked at all?....What is you CR?

Thank you...ViennaHog
 

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Discussion Starter #10
RoadGlide05inMD said:
You know that's got to be a fun ride! Did you use a .03 Cometic Head gasket? If not, my guess is that's where you gave away some performance. Still I think if you're not looking at numbers and just enjoying the ride, you have a great build.

Last questions: Were the heads decked at all?....What is you CR?

Thank you...ViennaHog
Baisley decked the heads so it would yield a 10.25:1cr with an .030 cometic gasket.

I have to admit that I became overly focused on the numbers, I just build myself up to expect a little more. It is fun ride. First time I really opened it up after the dyno tune I wasn't ready for "jump to light speed" on the first shift...just about lost my grip!
 

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05fatty said:
GRock,

thanks for your words of encouragement. You might recall a related discussion on this engine build I posted in the EFI Map forum.
http://www.v-twinforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=65789
You had a great insight to the problem I was having. Your reply was:

"The high lift, short duration of the cam in combination with the Baisley high velocity heads and high scavenge rate of the VH pipe can wreak havoc with the ECU tables (especially idle and low speed running) that the PCIII simply cannot correct with just fuel and timing. I can almost guarantee that the IAC is not open enough at idle (rough and uneven, right?) to compensate for the air needed by the heads and cam. And it takes a couple of seconds to get open enough after you hit the throttle to allow the engine to "clear" the sputter. As the throttle blade opens you now get the air you need and it runs better. Right?"

I switched to a SERT when I had it dyno tuned and figured between the SERT and a good tuner the sputtering would be gone. Boy was I wrong. Idle is still a little rough and the sputtering is STILL exactly as it was. The tuner I used in Phoenix was highly recommended by a couple of people, but he said the sputtering was caused by the cam...??? I emailed Bob Wood about his TW6-HG cam. He said..."The air fuel is off and dropping the rear cylinder. This is caused by lack of back pressure on your pro pipe." Bob suggested I block a couple of rows of holes in the Propipe baffle. I tried this and varied it from 1 to 2 rows...again, no improvement (in fact, the more rows that were blocked the worse it idled and sputtered). And FYI, when I pulled that baffle the first time it was very black and sooty, as well as every time I pulled it to change the configuration of the hose clamps.

edited: So, back to your original thoughts on the problem. It sounds like you're saying it can be addressed via the SERT. Unfortunately, I'm just learning SERT at this point; read springer's post on explaining the SERT and have looked at various tables, etc. using the tuning file the tuner gave me. I've looked at the IAC table, if this is what you're referring to. Where do I go from here (aside from the most obvious answer---a DIFFERENT qualified SERT tuner.

Thanks...Ed
OK, you asked for it!!!

You sound like that you are idling outside of the 0% throttle position, which means you lose the separate idle parameters of the ECU as these only operate in the 0 range. You need to adjust the throttle blade so that you are reading between .35 - .45 millivolts. This is the operating range for the TPS (throttle position sensor) at idle for 0%. When you get to that range you need to adjust the IAC to about 33 steps when the bike is warmed and idling. Drop the desired AFR in the 0 throttle row to 12.9 for the cells at 500 thru 1500 RPM. Next add about 6% to the VE numbers in the 750, 1000, & 1250 cells. Set your idle rpm to about 1050. You can change it later after you get this thing to run right. Do you have a popping on decel??? That is an indicator that you need to adjust the rest of the 0 row and perhaps the 2% also, but do NOTHING ELSE to the rest of any map.

OR

Get to a dyno tuner that knows how to adjust the idle parameters of the SERT.
 

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looks like it would be fun.
hey i could not see the dyno eather then i see this orange? and wonder what you mean.
i have my dyno printout here from last dyno a few weeks back, looks almost like this one but i get 105.6hp 105.7tq and my run starts at 2,500 was SAE 4th gear i have 3.37 primary and with chain at rear makes it 3.41, heads are HD done by my friend here in Oz 1.9 int 1.625ex stock head pipes Cycle shack slip ons baffle cut out wood 43.5 no air cleaner 10.25 comp 55g cams. its in a 01 dyna i just drag race now so will be uprating just no idea what i'll get from uprate? have s&s625 to put in also have a D carb i have owned 15 years, will weld port floors and am fitting 2" intake 1.615ex and want 30 degree pistons, right now i have se cv44 manifold but want to use s&s g with adapter for wood 43.5 then latter machine a tapper into the s&s 1" manifold spacer and try the D. i race with stock frame no wheelie bars street tire foot shift. any suggestions on comp i should run or anything else greatly appreciated, also i am looking for light wheels want 17" for rear so i can use micky thompson radial
sorry for mixing up post
 

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Lakes said:
looks like it would be fun.
hey i could not see the dyno eather then i see this orange? and wonder what you mean.
i have my dyno printout here from last dyno a few weeks back, looks almost like this one but i get 105.6hp 105.7tq and my run starts at 2,500 was SAE 4th gear i have 3.37 primary and with chain at rear makes it 3.41, heads are HD done by my friend here in Oz 1.9 int 1.625ex stock head pipes Cycle shack slip ons baffle cut out wood 43.5 no air cleaner 10.25 comp 55g cams. its in a 01 dyna i just drag race now so will be uprating just no idea what i'll get from uprate? have s&s625 to put in also have a D carb i have owned 15 years, will weld port floors and am fitting 2" intake 1.615ex and want 30 degree pistons, right now i have se cv44 manifold but want to use s&s g with adapter for wood 43.5 then latter machine a tapper into the s&s 1" manifold spacer and try the D. i race with stock frame no wheelie bars street tire foot shift. any suggestions on comp i should run or anything else greatly appreciated, also i am looking for light wheels want 17" for rear so i can use micky thompson radial
sorry for mixing up post

Hi Lakes, to get your name to orange means you got to pay for your membership...........this then lets you see everything on the site.

Bumping your cr to 10.5/11:1 and running octane additives will get your ponies up, changing to 98" will bump you some more and going to 1 3/4 I.D. pipes with 98" will free up your top end.............if you only plan to race the bike from now on.

All the best, Ozzie
 
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