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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I finally decided to go with Khrome Werks 2 1/2" HP-Plus Slip-ons on my 06 Train. I called the dealer only to have them tell me Custom Chrome won't have them available until April! I can't ride a sewing machine that long. So, I decided the Python 3 slip-ons would be equally acceptable. For under $250 bucks I figured them a great value. But then it happened. To get these relatively innexpensive pipes installed (and because I want the stage one EFI kit) I have to purchase the SERT $495 (+ 2 Hrs Labor @ $80/hr) and 5 hours on the dyno!

Pipes <$250
Stage 1 kit $140
SERT $495
Labor $560

Is that right? 5 Hours labor required just because they're not SEII pipes?
 

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killer sperm
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5 hours on the dyno means the operator is incompetent or a thief. 2 1/2 hours is more like it. I don't see how it could take much more than an hour to install the pipes and SERT. If you're just changing pipes you may be able to get away with no other changes.
 

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Infidel
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For just Stage 1 skip the dyno. It's easy to tweak the canned stage 1 map, besides there's not a huge difference between the slip-ons. Use one of the 20% off internet dealers and save $100 on the SERT. I tweaked the stage 1 map for my Thunderheader and it runs dead on...it was easy! If you're not planning (yeah right) any more upgrades a TFI/DFO or PC is another route that's cheaper.
 

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The Alter Ego
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Seems to be the shaft to me. Never knew you had to purchase the SERT in order to get a Stage I upgrade. Wheewww. It's getting pretty deep in them there dealerships.

While you came in for an oil change. We just decided to install a big bore on your bike. Is that okay with you? It will only cost you $#,###.## +SMSH+
 

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04 Ultra
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Gulfstream said:
For just Stage 1 skip the dyno. It's easy to tweak the canned stage 1 map, besides there's not a huge difference between the slip-ons. Use one of the 20% off internet dealers and save $100 on the SERT. I tweaked the stage 1 map for my Thunderheader and it runs dead on...it was easy! If you're not planning (yeah right) any more upgrades a TFI/DFO or PC is another route that's cheaper.
How do you go about tweaking the stage 1 map? I'm assuming you are talking about the map the dealer downloads as part of the pipe an SE air clean install.
 

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Hogndaas said:
I finally decided to go with Khrome Werks 2 1/2" HP-Plus Slip-ons on my 06 Train. I called the dealer only to have them tell me Custom Chrome won't have them available until April! I can't ride a sewing machine that long. So, I decided the Python 3 slip-ons would be equally acceptable. For under $250 bucks I figured them a great value. But then it happened. To get these relatively innexpensive pipes installed (and because I want the stage one EFI kit) I have to purchase the SERT $495 (+ 2 Hrs Labor @ $80/hr) and 5 hours on the dyno!

Pipes <$250
Stage 1 kit $140
SERT $495
Labor $560

Is that right? 5 Hours labor required just because they're not SEII pipes?
You don't need the SERT for stage one... but you will need the download... and you can't tweak the download. However, the map will only be somewhat close and you will feel it being slightly off. This bugged me.

I ended up buying the SERT and having it dyno'ed.

Bottom line: Decide on what you are going to do to the bike... do it... get the SERT and have it dyno'ed... it will save you a lot of money in the long run. The SERT will pay for itself in 2-3 download maps anyway. Every time you change a part, you will need a download or you will need to tweak the SERT. You can mess with the SERT forever.

It took them about five hours to dyno my bike. You can get the SERT for a lot less online and there is no installation so it shouldn't matter where you get it as long as it is BRAND NEW! Once used, the SERT is married to that bike and is useless on any other. Try this place:
http://www.zanottimotor.com/HarleyDavidson.html
 

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Unless you're planning on doing more extensive motor upgrades, you can add a DFO and adjust your mixture much like a carb. All for about the same money as the Stage 1 download.
 

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0043--Licensed to Doof!
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Buy the sert on-line: $370

Plug it in and download the new map yourself (hour max)

Go for the Arlen Ness Big Sucker (oh yeah, you have an 06)...the SE aircleaner kit (140) do the install yourself (hour max)

Get the pipes you want ($$$)
Install it yourself (hour max)

Tweak the map using the sert and the "seat of pants" programming, no need to Dyno it at this stage, wait until you toss in a 95/98" kit and cams to Dyno it.

I wouldn't waste the money on a dealer flash, DFO, or PCIII.
SERT, SERT, SERT!

Do it once, Do it right is my motto.

This is EXACTLY what I did to my bike.
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
That sounds like a plan...

Thanks for info...

I went to a different dealer and asked some questions today and they said 5 hours was too much. They did however recommend 2.5 hrs. The guy also worked really hard to talk me out of Python 3, Khrome Werks, and the like and recommended the Vance & Hines Stepped Drags. If you've seen my previous post this was a pipe I originally liked but got zero positive feedback on from those here. So now I back to the very confused state I was when I started. :confused:

The only thing I know at this point is I should buy XXX Pipes, install them myself. Buy the SERT and install it myself as well. Buy the K&N, Big Sucker, or SE Stage 1 air cleaner and install it myself. Then have the dealer tweak it in if I can't. I think.
 

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Just relax a bit. Its a lot of info to take in for someone new to H-Ds.

I faced the same thing when I bought my first EFI bike that I still own - '02 Road King. I didn't want to be dependant on a dealer. I bought the Scream'n Eagle Air Cleaner, Slip-on mufflers, and a Power Commander. Bike ran perfect. I changed my exhaust to a full Rinehart system, downloaded a new map to the Power Commander. My bike still runs PERFECT and I get ZERO deceleration popping like some people with their fancy SERTs get after hours on a dyno.

Even if you decide later to get with a big bore kit, the Power Commander will serve you just as well as a SERT as long as you have someone compentent tuning the bike. But for a basic Stage 1, you can do everything yourself.

Here are the Power Commander (PC) maps for a Softail:
http://www.powercommander.com/805mapsbystk.shtml

LOOK AT MAP M805-203. Order your Khrome Works from someone online and you'll have everything you want.

Personally I'm not a fan of slip-on mufflers on a Softail. They look too "added on". But if you're looking at cost, its a great way to go. Even Rinehart has slip-ons for Softails now.

Khrome Werks at Direct Parts. They have the tappered and slash cut.
https://www.directparts.com/cgi-bin/dp.store/44077590001f0f4c27434046233205b5/Product/View/31&2D410

I'd be more concerned about a bike being dogged on a dyno for 2.5 to 5.0 hours unless it has at least 2000 miles on it.

Good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Great input..

thatoldbike said:
Just relax a bit. Its a lot of info to take in for someone new to H-Ds.

I faced the same thing when I bought my first EFI bike that I still own - '02 Road King. I didn't want to be dependant on a dealer. I bought the Scream'n Eagle Air Cleaner, Slip-on mufflers, and a Power Commander. Bike ran perfect. I changed my exhaust to a full Rinehart system, downloaded a new map to the Power Commander. My bike still runs PERFECT and I get ZERO deceleration popping like some people with their fancy SERTs get after hours on a dyno.

Even if you decide later to get with a big bore kit, the Power Commander will serve you just as well as a SERT as long as you have someone compentent tuning the bike. But for a basic Stage 1, you can do everything yourself.

Here are the Power Commander (PC) maps for a Softail:
http://www.powercommander.com/805mapsbystk.shtml

LOOK AT MAP M805-203. Order your Khrome Works from someone online and you'll have everything you want.

Personally I'm not a fan of slip-on mufflers on a Softail. They look too "added on". But if you're looking at cost, its a great way to go. Even Rinehart has slip-ons for Softails now.

Khrome Werks at Direct Parts. They have the tappered and slash cut.
https://www.directparts.com/cgi-bin/dp.store/44077590001f0f4c27434046233205b5/Product/View/31&2D410

I'd be more concerned about a bike being dogged on a dyno for 2.5 to 5.0 hours unless it has at least 2000 miles on it.

Good luck!
Thanks for the great info. For the record, cost is not a concern. I figure if I spend 20K on a bike, I'm not going to skimp on the exhaust to save a couple of hundred. I was going slip-ons because they were cheap to get me by until I decided on a full system. I really like the look of the V&H Stepped Drags, but I can't get any real info on them. I also like the looks of the Cycle Shacks, Khrome Werks, Python 3's, etc... I just want a good looking, good sounding, good performing pipe. However, exhaust technology has as many myths as facts and trying to weed through all the marketing trash and personal input is trying.

I like what someone else said on a different thread; relax, drink decaf, pick some pipes, any pipes, put them on and ride.
 
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