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Old 11-08-2012, 02:26 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Automatic compression release questions

Hey, folks...talked to Bean a couple weeks ago about doing my heads this winter. Man, does this guy know his sh&t!....inside & out...He got me thinking about sh&t that I never considered, mainly, that with my heads milled to work right with my Andrews 57H cams (which I finally got my hands on), that I'd need a comp. release to be able to start it hot. (2008 FXDWG). For appearance sake, I'd like to stay away from the manual ones. I've been looking around the web, & I'd really like to go with the SE ACR's, but, according to what I've read so far, they require re-pinning the plugs in the harness (a PITA, but I can do this), but they also require a $150.00 download from the MOCO to make them work. (which I just don't want to mess with). To my thinking, they're just a 12VDC solenoid...I'd think that I would just be able to slave them from the start circuit, or install a seperate momentary switch somewhere out of sight to "pop them open" in case they can't handle sustained voltage. (hot the entire time the starter is engaged)....Does this sound like it could work, ...and...have any of you tried this? I've still got 6-7 weeks before I'm going to tear it down, so I figure I'll get as much input as possible until then (still get a good riding day once in a while in the Chicago area). Thanks in advance for your thoughts....Doug7x
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Old 11-08-2012, 10:17 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doug7x View Post
Hey, folks...talked to Bean a couple weeks ago about doing my heads this winter. Man, does this guy know his sh&t!....inside & out...He got me thinking about sh&t that I never considered, mainly, that with my heads milled to work right with my Andrews 57H cams (which I finally got my hands on), that I'd need a comp. release to be able to start it hot. (2008 FXDWG). For appearance sake, I'd like to stay away from the manual ones. I've been looking around the web, & I'd really like to go with the SE ACR's, but, according to what I've read so far, they require re-pinning the plugs in the harness (a PITA, but I can do this), but they also require a $150.00 download from the MOCO to make them work. (which I just don't want to mess with). To my thinking, they're just a 12VDC solenoid...I'd think that I would just be able to slave them from the start circuit, or install a seperate momentary switch somewhere out of sight to "pop them open" in case they can't handle sustained voltage. (hot the entire time the starter is engaged)....Does this sound like it could work, ...and...have any of you tried this? I've still got 6-7 weeks before I'm going to tear it down, so I figure I'll get as much input as possible until then (still get a good riding day once in a while in the Chicago area). Thanks in advance for your thoughts....Doug7x
Stick with manuals; you can't see them so I don't know what "apperance" issue you have. If stuck on ACRs, with the HD electrical system, probably best to avoid re-inventing the wheel and installing them per the manufacuturer's instruction. Having tinkered with these bikes for years, I have learned that every almost every time I think I am smarter than the MoCo, I am usually mistaken.

BTW, no knock on Bean; he is very good at what he does. However, with 57 cams, you might want to consider a larger intake valve and, IIRC, Bean does not change valve size when he ports.
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Old 11-08-2012, 11:36 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Bean is Great! To djl's point, you might want to consider larger valves. Bean can help you with those. ACR require additional head work too. ACR vents to the exhaust. I went with the ACR valve because I'm lazy and don't like the effect of a manual compression release venting fuel/air on the cylinder head. IMHO it looks bad. The ECM pulses the ACR valve to bleed off some of the cylinder pressure, not all. Some folks tie ACR to starter, which bleeds off more cylinder pressure than when connected to ECM. I've read in this forum that it works. However I only have first hand experience with ECM connected ACR. Skip the dealer download and get a TTS Mastertune. You'll need it to tune your bike. Good luck.
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Old 11-08-2012, 03:55 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I went with the ACR valve because I'm lazy and don't like the effect of a manual compression release venting fuel/air on the cylinder head. IMHO it looks bad.
Have manual CRs on my 95" and 107" and have no idea what you are talking about. Manuals close at the first upward movement of the piston, they are open for a nano second, unless one sticks which might require a throttle "blip" to close. No visible evidence of the fuel/air venting you make reference to.

Not that I have anything against ACRs, just wanted to note that the issue you make reference to with manuals has not been an issue for me.
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Old 11-08-2012, 06:01 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I designed and built my own tooling to drill the ACRs
I use a Jims manual CR tool top plate modified with a drill jig bushing as a starting point and depth datum and then use the DROs to control depth. Not a problem and they come out perfect every time.
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Old 11-08-2012, 07:24 PM   #6 (permalink)
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The stock 103's come with them for a reason you need them. If you jack a TC88 or TC96 up you need them.
Not having them is a short cut to save money .
Then you are on another thread complaining about starter and compensator problems.
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Old 11-08-2012, 07:47 PM   #7 (permalink)
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thanks, folks...I like the ACR's because they are hidden in the rocker box & vent internally...nobody knows you've been tweaking. I'm still searching this forum for the non-ECM wiring hookup that Tribal mentioned. As far as larger valves, I'm not going to go that far (YET)(maybe 107" after another year or two). I AM going to ask Bean to do my heads, but before I do, I've gotta know what I want, so all the ideas you could share are very welcome....thanks again
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Old 11-08-2012, 08:25 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I'm still searching this forum for the non-ECM wiring[/QUOTE]


Non ECM wiring is easy, use the low current power coming from your starter switch to share power to the starter relay and add another 4 pin relay for the ACR, now hook it up to the pin 85 and ground pin 86 , now get 12v. power and power the high current side of the relay pin 30 with at least a 14 ga. wire. I went ahead and purchase the ACR wiring from HD so I could use the connectors at the heads. do run the pin 87 to the harness and power each ACR and complete that circuit wiring by grounding it. works great on my 00 RK with 120R even as high 11000 ft. and as cold as 32 degrees.
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Old 11-08-2012, 08:53 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Ground one side of the ACR and feed power from the starter solenoid hot wire. ACR will work as long as the start button is pressed and starter engaged. I've had no problems wiring them this way.
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Old 11-08-2012, 09:43 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Old 11-09-2012, 01:38 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Ground one side of the ACR and feed power from the starter solenoid hot wire. ACR will work as long as the start button is pressed and starter engaged. I've had no problems wiring them this way.
Now, this is what I was hoping to be able to do...My only concern is can the coils in the ACR's be damaged if I leave the starter engaged too long?....is anyone else (besides Mopar) using this setup & are you also happy with it?....thanks again to all....keep it coming...
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Old 11-09-2012, 11:21 AM   #12 (permalink)
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You wont damage the coils, they can handle the 100% duty cycle for the short time of cranking. The problem with using the green wire (high current) from the starter solenoid is your taking amperage away from that starter solenoid circuit, and a few have reported problems with doing just that, just use the the low current going to the starter solenoid from the start switch and use it to power the solenoid (ACR relay). these relay coils don't take that much amps.
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Old 11-09-2012, 04:25 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by doug7x View Post
thanks, folks...I like the ACR's because they are hidden in the rocker box & vent internally...nobody knows you've been tweaking. I'm still searching this forum for the non-ECM wiring hookup that Tribal mentioned. As far as larger valves, I'm not going to go that far (YET)(maybe 107" after another year or two). I AM going to ask Bean to do my heads, but before I do, I've gotta know what I want, so all the ideas you could share are very welcome....thanks again
With this build you are going to have to tune it so why not get the proper harness which is a piece of cake to install and you can turn them on in the tuner software? But, what I really think is you should save yourself a lot of time and hassle. With those cams and Beans heads people will definitely know you have been tweaking so just do the manuals and be done with it, black buttons are hardly noticeable.
As far as the bigger valves you may gain a small amount, I have used a ton of Bean's heads and they work well with the stock valve size. He will install bigger intakes if you so wish.
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Old 11-09-2012, 11:02 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Old 11-10-2012, 04:11 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by BVBOB View Post
With this build you are going to have to tune it so why not get the proper harness which is a piece of cake to install and you can turn them on in the tuner software? But, what I really think is you should save yourself a lot of time and hassle. With those cams and Beans heads people will definitely know you have been tweaking so just do the manuals and be done with it, black buttons are hardly noticeable.
As far as the bigger valves you may gain a small amount, I have used a ton of Bean's heads and they work well with the stock valve size. He will install bigger intakes if you so wish.
Same advice here also.
Your trying to be stealth , with a 57 cammed 103?
Sorry don't get it?
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