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Old 10-24-2012, 05:28 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Axtell-bypass-system

This is a brand new product designed and developed by the Axtell Mountain motor team. With the stock OEM oiling system configuration when oil pressure becomes excessive it is bypassed from the high side of the feed to the low side...basically "looping". This causes aeration of the oil and many negitives. Aerated oil is spongy and causes lifter ticking. Also being spongy it results in an oil pressure drop that will cause the piston oilers to shut down. When this occurs engine heat builds and piston & ring life is shortened. Our system directs the bypassed oil into the cam chest to be returned to the oil tank eliminating the "loop".
Results: higher oil pressure at low engine rpms. longer oil life due to reduced oil shear,lower oil temperature, improved valve train control and noise. Fits all stock camplates. Patent Pending #61/693,612






http://www.axtellsales.com/Axtell-bypass-system.html
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Old 10-24-2012, 06:34 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Wonder if this fits the Screamin Eagle billet plate?
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:07 AM   #3 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by todd comer View Post
Wonder if this fits the Screamin Eagle billet plate?
They have one for the SE plate . It is .077 shorter IIRC
I don't have the part#
The one shown fits stock or t man plates
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Old 10-24-2012, 08:43 AM   #4 (permalink)
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Interesting idea, my only concern would be too much oil for the sump to keep up with, probably the reason it was looped in the first place. A thayer 3 stage pump would eliminate any issues there.
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Old 10-24-2012, 09:25 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Had some good conversations about this piece a few weeks ago. I will be giving it a whirl along with my other winter upgrades.
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Old 10-24-2012, 04:50 PM   #6 (permalink)
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So, let me get this right. H-D makes two upgrades to the OEM oil pump to increase pressure and scavenging capacity. Now we have to have a bypass system to compensate for the excessive pressure created by the upgraded and improved pumps??

Seems we never stop coming up with ways to add complexity to what is a very simple system. The H-D loop system actuall isn't that bad. JMHO.
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Old 10-24-2012, 11:15 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Aerated oil is spongy and causes lifter ticking. Also being spongy it results in an oil pressure drop that will cause the piston oilers to shut down. When this occurs engine heat builds and piston & ring life is shortened. Our system directs the bypassed oil into the cam chest to be returned to the oil tank eliminating the "loop".
Results: higher oil pressure at low engine rpms. longer oil life due to reduced oil shear,lower oil temperature, improved valve train control and noise
along with the advantages quoted above.
there is also the advantage of having a positive bypass seat.
if you got one of those motors that sump 5 -6 oz no matter what you do,as a bonus this might be the fix
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Old 10-25-2012, 12:06 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I totally agree that aerated oil contributes to valve train noise; long time advocate and remarks in that regard have been scoffed at on other forums.

However, if the oil is not aerated why does one need the Axtell piece of hardware?

The piston oilers have to see 15psi to open, so I am not really understanding how spongy oil would drop normal operating oil pressure from say 30psi to less than 15 and cause the oilers to shut down when they would normally be open; miust be missing something.

I suppose I can see the value of the bypass system in a big inch modified motor with a three phase pump but don't really see the application for the typical Stage I or Stage II motor.

Not trying to be argumentative; just trying to understand how this piece of hardware would apply to one of my motors and whether or not there is a real benefit.
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Old 10-25-2012, 12:44 PM   #9 (permalink)
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cavitation
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Old 10-25-2012, 03:40 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Not making any comments vis-a-vis the effectiveness of this priduct, but highly aerated oil has exactly zero lubricating properties... I'm not real clear on just what causes this apparent aeration. How does this "loop" -- which I am interpreting essentially as a recirculation -- result in aeration?

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Old 10-25-2012, 05:16 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n.e.confederate View Post
Not making any comments vis-a-vis the effectiveness of this priduct, but highly aerated oil has exactly zero lubricating properties... I'm not real clear on just what causes this apparent aeration. How does this "loop" -- which I am interpreting essentially as a recirculation -- result in aeration?
Not sure I understand your question but IMHO, the supply gerotor would probably be the source of aeration in very low oil pressure situations. Additionally, it is my understanding that certain oils are more prone to aeration than others.

I understand the principal behind the product but am not sure of the appliication. I don't see any benefit for a stock, Stage I or Stage II motor but just don't know under what circumstances one would consider the addtion of this system would be beneficial.
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Old 10-25-2012, 09:36 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Or you could send the oil back to the sump like they do on nearly every conventional hydraulic circuit and in this case it would have some if not all of the residual air removed when traveling through the baffle. Plus heat removed. Oil over relief = heat generated. One more benefit, less sump oil to deal with. While we are it a little cooling loop through the heads through a cooler and back to tank...
Oh that won't fly, it will look not aesthetically pleasing with added plumbing externally, cancel the thought.
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Last edited by nw_guy4_fun; 10-25-2012 at 09:44 PM.
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Old 10-25-2012, 11:41 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nw_guy4_fun View Post
Or you could send the oil back to the sump like they do on nearly every conventional hydraulic circuit and in this case it would have some if not all of the residual air removed when traveling through the baffle. Plus heat removed. Oil over relief = heat generated. One more benefit, less sump oil to deal with. While we are it a little cooling loop through the heads through a cooler and back to tank...
Oh that won't fly, it will look not aesthetically pleasing with added plumbing externally, cancel the thought.
Excellent ideas.
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Old 10-26-2012, 07:10 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djl View Post
I totally agree that aerated oil contributes to valve train noise; long time advocate and remarks in that regard have been scoffed at on other forums.

However, if the oil is not aerated why does one need the Axtell piece of hardware?

The piston oilers have to see 15psi to open, so I am not really understanding how spongy oil would drop normal operating oil pressure from say 30psi to less than 15 and cause the oilers to shut down when they would normally be open; miust be missing something.

I suppose I can see the value of the bypass system in a big inch modified motor with a three phase pump but don't really see the application for the typical Stage I or Stage II motor.

Not trying to be argumentative; just trying to understand how this piece of hardware would apply to one of my motors and whether or not there is a real benefit.
cooler oil because it is bypassed into the cam chest and returned to the tank before it is sent to the top end again.
the stock bypass seats, on the cast surface of the camplate. now there is a hardened seat with the insert.
idle oil pressure has been reported to be 12-16 psi. with cruise pressure the same or slightly lower.32-38 psi.
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Old 10-26-2012, 10:23 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Or you could consider the bypass oil a new circuit and use it to cool the heads by way of an external cooler then back to sump..
Just saying
OK.. back to your regularly scheduled program.
Price is right on that valve diverter
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Last edited by nw_guy4_fun; 10-26-2012 at 10:26 AM.
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