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Old 09-02-2012, 04:15 PM   #1 (permalink)
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120R crate or 120 build?

Hi All,
Getting my new bike soon and plan on pulling the 103 out. My plan is to have a 120 with mild headwork and a 662 cam. Trouble is I'm not sure which way I should go.

Option 1: Easiest and most preferred. Buy a crate motor pull the heads have them worked over, swap the cams, roller rockers and drop it in. Then worry about the fabled "crank" and I'm not entirely convinced it's justified anyway.

Option 2: Buy all the 120 pieces then have the crank welded balanced and a timken conversion done. Never have to worry about the bottom end but its more money and a lot of work sending parts all over hells half acre. Then I have to assemble it all.

Any thoughts or opinions?

Thanks,
J.
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Old 09-02-2012, 04:24 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Totenkopf is reading this now saying WTF is this?
more importantly, have you identified your trusted tuner yet?
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Old 09-02-2012, 04:33 PM   #3 (permalink)
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more importantly, have you identified your trusted tuner yet?
Yes! Chad at Roeder racing says he can get it to kick @ss.....
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Old 09-02-2012, 04:50 PM   #4 (permalink)
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If you have the budget, do it as a build. What we like to do is buy the SE cylinders and 0.010" over pistons, then bore and hone the cylinders to fit the pistons. That way we know the cylinders are true. Seen too many out of round SE cylinders. The other thing we do is disassemble the SE heads and check everything. Seen too many with bad guides and other issues. We also trust the Timken conversion and then weld and true the crank. You don't get any of this in the crate motor. The other thing we've been doing is upgrading to the DT 3 stage oil pump. We're not fans of running big lift cams for street motors. We try to keep the lifts closer to 0.600". A recent scratch built 120 we did like this, made almost 140 ft-lbs and hp was well in the 130's. It's a real good build combination for more than adequate power and reliability.
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Old 09-02-2012, 05:19 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Thanks. My gut says build it but the cheapskate and lazy side of me says do the crate motor. I have the money but wondering if it's overkill for the application? Meaning it's a road king, not a drag bike. I'm not going to wheelie around town or do giant burnouts. What I will do it wring it out to redline at least everyday and utilize the full potential of the roll on performance. Decisions, decisions.

What is a DT 3 stage pump...I never hear dof it. Also I didn't see the SE cylinders and 0.010" over pistons in the catalog but maybe I missed it.
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Old 09-02-2012, 05:35 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cruzmisl View Post
Thanks. My gut says build it but the cheapskate and lazy side of me says do the crate motor. I have the money but wondering if it's overkill for the application? Meaning it's a road king, not a drag bike. I'm not going to wheelie around town or do giant burnouts. What I will do it wring it out to redline at least everyday and utilize the full potential of the roll on performance. Decisions, decisions.

What is a DT 3 stage pump...I never hear dof it. Also I didn't see the SE cylinders and 0.010" over pistons in the catalog but maybe I missed it.
Big inch big power baggers are a frekin ball to ride, you won't regret putting a stout mill in that RK. Tote's talkin bout a Dan Thayer oil pump, google it , you will find it.
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Old 09-02-2012, 05:36 PM   #7 (permalink)
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I had a 107 with stage 2 heads in my last RK. An absolute riot and hoping the 120 will make me forget someone stole it from my garage while I was home...............
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Old 09-02-2012, 06:06 PM   #8 (permalink)
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I had a 107 with stage 2 heads in my last RK. An absolute riot and hoping the 120 will make me forget someone stole it from my garage while I was home...............


Dirtbags like that need to be killed...slowly...over a period of months, or years...
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Old 09-02-2012, 07:11 PM   #9 (permalink)
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IMO
just do the crate.
ride it a season or two then if it has problems or you want more ? you have something to do.
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Old 09-02-2012, 07:34 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Take your 103"er...send it to Randy @ Hyperformance, and let him send you back a 117"er with a bullet proofed bottom end that will blow the doors off a 120R for about the same money as a 120R crate motor.
Randy can do it all in house...timkens conversion, balance, true, plug & weld the bottom end, case boring, and I would add H-Beam rods. You would have to pick out your piston/cylinder/cam combo you wanted to use. And he can re-work your stock heads, or put on a set of his double quinch heads on it. Then all you have to do is drop it back in, put your T/body and exhaust back on...tune it up. I suggest when tuning it, to set it on the kill mode ! It will run like a bat out of hell. Hold on tight and have fun.
Something to think about.

Just my 2 cents...from No Cents

117" Darkhorse build...all smiles !!!


Last edited by No Cents; 09-02-2012 at 08:00 PM.
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Old 09-02-2012, 08:29 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Totenkopf is reading this now saying WTF is this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by cruzmisl View Post
Thanks. My gut says build it but the cheapskate and lazy side of me says do the crate motor. I have the money but wondering if it's overkill for the application? Meaning it's a road king, not a drag bike. I'm not going to wheelie around town or do giant burnouts. What I will do it wring it out to redline at least everyday and utilize the full potential of the roll on performance. Decisions, decisions.

What is a DT 3 stage pump...I never hear dof it. Also I didn't see the SE cylinders and 0.010" over pistons in the catalog but maybe I missed it.
here's the DT 3 stage pump.
DT pump link...

It's not about wheelies & burnouts. It's about having adequate power when 2 up, loaded down and trying to pass an 18 wheeler in a tight spot when you need to. I find it to partially be a safety issue and then of course the fun factor of having the ability to accelerate with authority.
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Old 09-02-2012, 08:47 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Oh, no don't get me wrong, I love power. What I meant by the wheelies and burnouts is that I'm not planning on trying to get a 1.2s 60ft time. That would be harder on the crank than rolling the throttle on the highway with the wifey on the back, no???
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Old 09-02-2012, 10:11 PM   #13 (permalink)
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strokerjlk is reading this now saying WTF is this?
I have done about everything you can do to one. Watebox/ dry burnouts. 1.85 60 ft
6000 rpm shifts no clutch on the track
down shifts from 4 th to 2 nd for 50 mph roll on's Been over center on wheelies ( Reinhart t/d don't work for wheelie bars)6000-6200 rpms in 5th gear for miles. IBA SS 1000 ( two up 1100 miles in 18 hr ) The crank ain't shifted yet.
Don't sweat it
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Old 09-02-2012, 10:21 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Thanks! That's reassuring stroker. You have a dyno sheet with the 662-2? That's what I was thinking of going with. Are the SE rockers as good as the S&S rollers?
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Old 09-03-2012, 12:39 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cruzmisl View Post
Thanks! That's reassuring stroker. You have a dyno sheet with the 662-2? That's what I was thinking of going with. Are the SE rockers as good as the S&S rollers?
the SE rockers are fine.IMO
run # 15 BLUE the first time I tuned the 662-2 in my bike. (quick tune)
run # 36 RED I tuned it again 6 mts later same 662-2 cams
run 41 GREEN was with the SE 266 cams.
all were with R/H T/D'S 3.5 mufflers performance baffles
other pipes are better,but these ain't bad


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