Nightrider

[johNTO]

Originally Posted by kslg

Take a look at this thread to answer your exact question:

http://www.v-twinforum.com/forums/v-...loop-mode.html


...

kslg, thanks for the link. After reading the threads I think I have a better understanding about what the IED's are doing....I think

[cruiser85257]

http://www.hdforums.com/m_2836828/tm.htm

[johNTO]

Cruiser, thanks for the great link! You did a fine job running with this one.

[cruiser85257]

Your welcome John and Thank You.

Dave

[airmann6]

I just installed the IED wires and a Ness Big Sucker to go with my V&H Oval Slip ons on my 08 Street Glide . There does seem to be a significant improvement in the way the bike sounds and pulls . The Ness system is way better than the HD one for sure and the wires took about 30 minutes to completely install and secure nicely . If the bike doesn't show any adverse signs when the hot days get here I will be totally happy with this set up .

[kslg]

I've got my IED's ready to install; I am going to wait until the weather gets hotter. It seems to run no more than 180* right now with temps being in the 60's and 70's.

The only concern I have is that it has been said that these can shorten the life of the O2 sensors to about 8-10k miles. Question is: How do you know when they go bad?

Also waiting the arrival of the Doherty Machine intake kit to install at the same time.

How did you find the sound to be different?

[airmann6]

I had not heard about shorter o2 life , I'll ask them about that . Sound is deeper , just sounds richer so I am contributing that to the wires . I really didn't think it would do anything but I could actually notice it .

[kslg]

To see the info about shortened life, see this thread:

http://www.v-twinforum.com/forums/v-...loop-mode.html


People who are using them are saying the plugs are less "bleach white" as well.

[cruiser85257]

1- The narrow band O2 sensor produces the voltage directly from a zirconium dioxide cell. It is the source of the 0-1V signal. A signal of .250V means nothing more to the life of the sensor than a signal of .500V or .750V.

2- The operating range of a narrow band O2 sensor produces a calibrated 0-1V output over air fuel ranges of 17.0:1 to 12.5:1.

3- The output characteristics of narrow band O2 sensors are most accurate in the 14.0:1 to 15.0:1 range. The O2 IED happens to be working at 14.2:1, which happens to be in the range where NBO2 sensor output is quite linear. While the response curve of nbo2 sensors is more abrupt over 800mV, it is still within the design limits of the O2 sensor.

4- The OEM fuel map in the Harley always has the bike running at 12.0:1 just after engine startup. There are significant portions of the OEM HD fuel maps and the HD Stage 1/2 upgrades that put open loop AFRs at 12.5:1 AFR.

5- If you use SERT to tune the Bias Tables in the HD ECM, you can set the bias values to 792, which happens to be .792V or a value higher than the O2 IED artificially alters the bias table value to. So HD has obviously determined that higher voltages at the O2 sensor are not hurting it. For those who do not know what the Bias voltage means, that is the voltage that the ECM looks for to determine rich/lean values coming from the O2 sensor.

6- In the latest releases of HD ECM code, the engine goes through several stages of heat management. As part of the overheating code, the engine will richen the fuel mixture to 12.0:1. All this is explained in the latest Manual for PRO SERT.

7- Riders that have pulled their PowerCommander and TFI's that use O2 eliminators off their 07/08 (including 06 Dyna's) bikes, then reconnected the orignal O2 sensors have reported no ill effects from the engine and are not reporting ECM codes. Considering the number of riders/shops that typically set idle/low RPM fuel maps much richer than required (11.5 to 12.5:1), you would think that this group of riders would report instant failure of their O2 sensors and error codes appearing when they changed equipment.

Don't take my word for it. Below is an engineering data sheet for narrow band O2 sensors. Ask the "nay sayers" to find one word about a too much voltage output hurting the life of the narrow band sensor or too rich a mixture decreasing life. Ask them to find an "engineering or automotive study" that shows the output of the zirconium dioxide cell degrades faster with fuel mixtures falling into the operating range of the o2 sensor. Ask them to find a well know and trusted performance Harley mechanic to prove that running an O2 sensor is going to decrease the life of the sensor. The best they will probably do is mention a "friend of a friend" that had a problem with an O2 sensor after doing some work on the bike. And I'd be willing to bet I could explain the premature failures of any O2 sensor based on my comments below.

Things that I do know will hurt the life of any O2 sensor are:
the use of leaded gasoline (or additives),
operating temperatures well over 1400 degrees,
very small amounts of silicone sealers getting into the combustions chamber or exhaust stream (which is why you see automotive stores selling O2 sensor friendly gasket sealers)
In the HD world, the use of leaded fuels/additives is common and the use of silcon sealers that are not O2 sensor safe are both fairly common. So any premature failures are most likely due to one of these.

[kslg]

Holy information Batman. Good Stuff, thanks.

How long do these O2 sensors typically last?

[airmann6]

I do think this IED , Big sucker setup is a more dramatic improvement than any of the HD Stg 1 setups I have had on previous new bikes .

[johNTO]

My riding season has finally started!

When I fired up the bike I instantly noticed a slightly louder and throatier note from the stock pipes. After a 2 hour ride on my bone stock 2008 FLHX with the IED's I am very pleased with the results.
Not only does the bike sound better (IMO), throttle response seems to be a lot more linear with no noticeable surging from idle and the hint of popping(pre-IED's) on hard decel is gone.
The bike was reading air temp between 50-55F so I'm curious to see what kind of results the summer temps will bring.
For around $70, the IED's have given me what I want...a nice sounding, smoother running bone stock bike!

Ride safe....

[cruiser85257]

Johnto I'm riding down here in temps that are in the mid 80's. I check my engine temps with an infrared thermometer. So far with the IED's I am still running below 300 degrees (measured by the spark plug). The IED's are holding up very well in the warmer weather.

[johNTO]

Originally Posted by cruiser85257

Johnto I'm riding down here in temps that are in the mid 80's. I check my engine temps with an infrared thermometer. So far with the IED's I am still running below 300 degrees (measured by the spark plug). The IED's are holding up very well in the warmer weather.

Thanks for the head's up, Cruiser. Your results are what I'm looking for this summer!
I've been following your thread on the other HD site and very interested in the early results coming back from NightRider's new Extreme IED's.
I'm thinking the XIED's are more suitable for a bike with a freer flowing A/C and pipes and the current IED's are enough for a stock bike? (Just wondering out loud if it's worth changing my current generation IED's to the XIED's on a bone stock bike?)

[kslg]

It looks like head temps are coming down +/- 100*.

Anyone know the effect on oil temps?