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Old 08-08-2008, 07:02 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Cool Curing TC88 Engine (Valve Train) Noise

I have put some miles on two road kings -- 50K on a 2002 RK classic TC88 bone stock, and 14K on a 2006 RK classic with a stage I kit (air filter, pipes, hd remap). I've run HD dino 20-50 oil in both bikes. Muleskinner, in another post on engine noise nailed the noise problem I have with the 2006. I've quoted Muleskinner's post on the noise below...

"I hear a light "tinny type of noise" coming from the engine area while running in 5th or 6th gear at around 70 MPH. The noise gets more pronounced when I lightly accelerate from this speed.

At first I thought I was hearing a light ignition pinging noise. After trying different speeds and gears, I can hear the noise anytime I lightly accelerate from a steady speed. After much riding and listening to the noise, I have come to the conclusion the noise is coming from the valve train and is not ignition pinging."

After much searching on this forum, I've found all sorts of solutions to the engine noise problem...

1) Change to synthetic Mobil I oil...

2) No, change back from synthetic oil to dino oil...

3) Put a Baisley spring in the oil pump by-pass valve...

4) Nope, the Baisley spring doesn't work...

5) Get rid of the stage 1 upgrade and go back to bone stock to get rid of "pinging"...a couple of problems here...is the noise pinging, or just "normal" valve clatter? I will note that my stock 02 had loud valve clatter (which I loved), but it was consistent across the RPM range, so maybe going back to a non-stage I would help?

6) Switch to AMS lifters since Harley changed out the part supplier for lifters in 2001 to a GM versus a Johnson supplier...The claim is that AMS has gone back to the Johnson supplier for their lifters and their lifters are better...

7) Get an IPOD and give up on it Jack!!!

8) Switch back to an old air-head Beemer with the adjustable valve gear and give up on the whole hydraulic lifter thing altogether (blasphemy...forgive me Mr. Harley and Mr. Davidson)

Your thoughts and opinions on ways of getting rid of the noise Muleskinner described in my 2006 RKC would be appreciated. Options 7 and 8 above are off the table at the moment...thanks...
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Old 08-08-2008, 07:36 PM   #2 (permalink)
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To many if and's and maybe's. A ping will sound like a rock in a tin can but only makeing intermetently at lower rpm's and under load, But not cruise'n down the road. I can hear hear the pistons moveing up and down in a harely so yes you will hear the valves. Is it different than ten thousand miles ago. They can bleed down sometimes then it will sound like and old chevy when you start it tap tap tap then gone.With the air kit you do hear more noise ,but valve noise. Some hd mufflers also have a tinny sound. If it did it with the stage one and not with out it ,it ain't valves train. By the air plugs or an ipod. OH, AMS is first rate ,not a over the top always bigger is better shop. If you had a e-glide and change to a new type aftermarket shield CEE BAILY's you will hear so many new sounds that you know it is going to blow up.I know that.
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Old 08-08-2008, 09:12 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Interesting comment: "you hear more valve noise with the stage 1" I'm thinking I'll try switching the 06 back to bone stock (I bought it with the stage 1 installed) and see what effect that has. First, I'm going to try going with some Mobile 1 to see if that has any effect on the clatter when rolling on the throttle from 65 to 70mph. The AMS lifters are cheap enough at about $100 for a set of 4, but six hours of labor to do a lifter swap doesn't come cheap.
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Old 08-08-2008, 09:22 PM   #4 (permalink)
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I'll tell you what cures it for me 100%. I put in some AMS lifters and a set of TP rocker boxes(do a google for them or search here).

I can tell you it is a true joy to have zero noise. I never realized how loud my bike was(about 73,000 miles worth of loud) until I put these parts on/in.

A lifter swap shouldn't take 6 hours unless the person doing it plans on re-using stock push-rods.
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Old 08-11-2008, 10:10 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Mine clattered like castanets when I first got it. I changed to Mobile One and that helped only slightly, then the next oil change I added a half qt of the Lucas synthetic oil additive. Huge difference! I still get a little chatter now and then, but it is significantly improved. The engine also seems to run a little cooler as well. My oil temp rarely goes over 235 whereas before 260-270 was common. I will eventually do a mechanical fix as HDMarsh did above, but not until I'm ready for my next build...
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Old 08-12-2008, 04:19 AM   #6 (permalink)
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I switched to Amsoil 20-50 in all 3 holes and have the AMS lifters, now I hear a sound I never heard before...the fuel pump humming!! ha
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Old 08-12-2008, 03:43 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Is this noise causing any harm to the engine or just noise. Get louder pipes.
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Old 08-12-2008, 06:52 PM   #8 (permalink)
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What??? Did you say louder pipes??? Sorry, couldn't hear you...my ears are still ringing from back when I put those straight pipes on my Triumph Bonney. You see, the sound of the motor is one of the main reasons I started on Harley's in the first place -- it sure wasn't the superior handling or the outstanding horsepower. I don't mind a little valve clatter...in fact I live for it, but this sounds crappy, not at all like the beautiful music my 02 King made, or for that matter the valve clatter on an airhead Beemer. Apparently just another case of newer not being better...Maybe I should just try another 2002 King.
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Old 08-13-2008, 10:09 AM   #9 (permalink)
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where ya at in Va?
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Old 08-13-2008, 10:19 AM   #10 (permalink)
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Engine Noise

I have a 05 RK with 17K on it. Running Amsoil 20-50 syn, stage 1 kit with KN filter and SE pipes and I have all kinds of engine noise. Most light tapping from the lifters at certain RPM's. I can reduce this by removing the windshield! All the engine noise get's magnified with the windsheild on. I do have pinging when I twist the throttle hard but that is due to my plugs fouling from fule or oil!
Anyone have an 05 with valve seal issues?
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Old 08-13-2008, 11:40 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hdmarsh77 View Post
I'll tell you what cures it for me 100%. I put in some AMS lifters and a set of TP rocker boxes(do a google for them or search here).

I can tell you it is a true joy to have zero noise. I never realized how loud my bike was(about 73,000 miles worth of loud) until I put these parts on/in.

A lifter swap shouldn't take 6 hours unless the person doing it plans on re-using stock push-rods.
Thanks for this post You have helped me from pulling the rest of my hair out. I checked out the AMS lifters and realized I had taken them out of my original 99 engine. I put in new A type in just to be safe with a cam change. You can check the rest of my findings on this thread.
http://www.v-twinforum.com/forums/v-...b-lifters.html
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Old 08-14-2008, 04:42 PM   #12 (permalink)
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The bike's at the dealer...looks like I finally found a dealer who has found the source of the problem. The dealer found three problems: 1) Broken Motor Mount; 2) Previous Dealer Loaded the Wrong ECM map for the air cleaner and slip ons; and 3) Idiot Painter I used left two bolts out of the rear fender. I'm getting all three fixed and pick up the bike tomorrow...hopefully the noise is now gone. Thanks for all your comments.
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Old 08-14-2008, 09:46 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cts1950 View Post
Thanks for this post You have helped me from pulling the rest of my hair out. I checked out the AMS lifters and realized I had taken them out of my original 99 engine. I put in new A type in just to be safe with a cam change. You can check the rest of my findings on this thread.
http://www.v-twinforum.com/forums/v-...b-lifters.html
Sweet!

My hair is falling out on it's own, so if I can help a guy from pulling his out then I did good.

HAHA!
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Old 08-14-2008, 10:30 PM   #14 (permalink)
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I was speaking with a HD mechanic today at a dealer and he was quite interested in the ams lifters. They have been fighting lifter noise ever since 2001 and have been using Jim's lifters in non stock engines they put together. He and i got together with their parts manager and they want to stock some.
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Old 08-15-2008, 09:51 AM   #15 (permalink)
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We cure lifter noise here via straight 50W Spectro, or Torco, along with an oil pump shim.
If in fact, the machine has adj pushrods, we load them .140-.150" into the lifter.
Quiets the engine right down.
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