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Old 12-13-2012, 02:15 PM   #61 (permalink)
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I guess unions are ok if you want someone else to dictate your own self worth.
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Old 12-13-2012, 02:18 PM   #62 (permalink)
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Perfectly said
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Old 12-13-2012, 04:31 PM   #63 (permalink)
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James is reading this now saying WTF is this? James is reading this now saying WTF is this?
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I guess unions are ok if you want someone else to dictate your own self worth.
Union reps don't stand on picket lines, vote on contract issues, go on strike or risk losing their job over contract issues. That's up to the members. In my state the unions cannot give a dime to a politician unless a member designates a portion of their pay to go to a fund for that purpose.
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Old 12-13-2012, 06:09 PM   #64 (permalink)
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Union reps don't stand on picket lines, vote on contract issues, go on strike or risk losing their job over contract issues. That's up to the members. In my state the unions cannot give a dime to a politician unless a member designates a portion of their pay to go to a fund for that purpose.
And of course with Illinois' history of no political corruption.....
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:17 PM   #65 (permalink)
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Not even close to being the truth.
It's a lot closer than conservatives telling American Workers they're interested in preserving their "rights" in the workplace...
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:24 PM   #66 (permalink)
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Provide proof of this happening. I work in a right to work state. The hourly workers down on the mfg floor receive the same benefits and vacation packages as we who are salaried.
Which whould be higher under a union presense. My proof is that EVERY nonunion shop we organized resulted in employees seeing 50% to 100% increases in hourly wages, not to mention partaking in a benefit package many had never have before, as well as pensions, advanced training, access to cutting edge technology...

So spare me your anecdotal evidence that life gets better for workers when they're nonunion. They don't. If they didn't do better in a union then business wouldn't be so against them.

The rule of thumb os that a capitalist and labor have completely different and often opposite goals.

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As far as their pay goes, they are certainly entitled to form and unionize and don't think for one second the leaders of the IBEW wouldn't love to do just that as they certainly see the $$$ they could be getting.
Union leaders don't get members dues monies. All unions are audited by the DOL annually. But feel free to spew more propoganda.
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At my former company it was exactly the same thing. Only there the IBEW gained a small foothold and they used a few discontents to spread lies such as mgrs promoting women for sexual favors. In the end they couldn't even convince the hourly workers to even bring unionization to a vote. And be certain the Dept. of Labor was there to ensure that management didn't so much as whisper to workers about unionizing.
Wow, a corporate campaign won, or an organizing drive failed in Colorado... That proves everything...
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:30 PM   #67 (permalink)
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This is all very funny, It all boils down to if the union is so wonderful why are they losing members the way they are?
That's like saying if Main St businesses are so good, how come so many get shuttered when WalMart comes to town?

You have a lot to learn about causaulity spdrcr. Just because A happens then B happens does not necessarily mean A caused B. More impiracl evidence is needed in order to form an opinion that isn't already predetermined by the observer.


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Does anyone think that wonder bread was asking to much for a driver to deliver both bread and twinkies on the same truck? No they werent but the union knew if they could make them I mean force them to use two different trucks that would mean two drivers and two lemmings paying the dues. This is one very simple example of the union forcing up the labor costs.
Actually, each driver would do 2x with each product line so there is no aggregate gain in the workforce. But don't let the obvious or common sense or plain simple 1st grade math dissuade you from making a fool out of yourself.
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:31 PM   #68 (permalink)
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business are against them because of the bull. Lets go back to the hostess situation where a truck couldnt carry bread and twinkies WTF? And what about the chrystler workers reinstated? You really think they should be working now? And spare me the whole it wasnt proven what they were doing bull. The photos didnt lie, brown bottle with a bud light label. And the union supported these dirt bags. Now you really want to know why people are fed up. I dont care what side your on those guys should be walking period.
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:32 PM   #69 (permalink)
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Keep up the good work detroit. Great union town LOL
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:40 PM   #70 (permalink)
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The Bureau of Labor Statistics reported Friday that unions lost 612,000 members in 2010, dropping the unionized share of the work force to 11.9 percent from 12.3 percent in 2009. That follows a loss of 771,000 workers in 2008, continuing a steady decline from the 1950s when more than a third of workers belonged to unions.

At this rate they will all be gone in 25 years.
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:41 PM   #71 (permalink)
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Bones is (or was) BA at the IBEW in Long Island (as I remember?).
Not a BA. I have been and when needed more than willing, instrumental in organizing shops, or cherrypicking nonunion workers from competing shops. This is how I know nonunion electricians in NYC are paid 20-24.00 and hour TOPS and get NO benefits, while the prevailing wage rate is currently 56.00 an hour, plus fringes. In fact, one hour of labor costs a union contractor a minimum of 108.00 an hour.

Perhaps using those figures you could explain how nonunion contractors bids come it at or around union contractors when their comparative hourly load is less than 40 bucks an hour?

See Danny, this is how I know the nonunion stand is a line of buIIshi+ because I encounter the truth over and over, time and time again.

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He is also a devout athiest,
I bounce between Atheist and Agnostic.

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hater of the military,
How can you not hate an institution that imprisons a member 23 hours a day naked?

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liberal northeast elitist, and avowed democratic socialist.
How DARE YOU call me avowed!!!

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But that's why we love him (even though he hates us because we're red necks).
"Flyover bumpkins." (If "bumpkin" is still P.C...)
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:43 PM   #72 (permalink)
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Why would they not want to join and pay dues?
Because many people want something for nothing, or fail to see, or believe the consequenses of their actions.

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See bones...this is what "choice" means. People make decisions - right or wrong. Your job is to make the sale....but be careful...don't promise what you can't deliver....like what just happened in Michigan, when people see that the emperor has no clothes, they'll head for the exits.
I agree, like when people see how RTW legislation negatively affects them and those around them.
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:44 PM   #73 (permalink)
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Keep up the good work detroit. Great union town LOL
Oh yeah, some real prosperity going on there.

Proof that one-party rule isn't such a good idea.

http://www.urbanghostsmedia.com/2012...nsions-houses/
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:51 PM   #74 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by jammer45u View Post

Look at that poster hanging on the wall in the employee lunchroom or next to the time clock. It will outline all the government work regulation and explain how to contact each agency. Things like:

Whistleblower Act
Family and Medical Leave Act
Anti- Discrimination
Right to Know
Equal Opportunity
Workers Compensation
Unified Service Employment and Reemployment Act
Polygraph Protection
OSHA Protection
Youth Employment Standards
Minimum Wage and Overtime Pay
All of these things only came about by grassroots union member-funded political action. Think they'll remain in place, and properly funded without the presence of unions, or did you think that laws never chance, like, Michigan's new Right To Work law?

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Aren't many of those things the very reason unions were formed? Maybe their work has been done, but in order to justify their existence they continue to push deeper and demand more than the company they are working for can afford.
Unions never demand more than a company can afford. If that is ever used as a talking point, the company must prove it by opening their books and showing how they cannot meet reasonable demands and improvements to collective bargaining agreements.

Never seen a company do it yet.

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Are greedy owners pushing manufacturing overseas or is it unrealistic labor demands and government over-regulation?
Manufacturing went overseas at the same rate from union states as nonunion states.

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Work rules aren't made to protect the worker, they are made to increase workforce.
Patently false.

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Fear and mistrust are fostered to polarize employees and management. Hard working, dedicated, reliable employees are chastised while unproductive and unreliable employees are protected.
All employees get protection, that's the union's job. It's up to a company to prove a case of wrongdoing or a violation of the contract.

I bet you thing defendants in court aren't entitled to legal representation too.
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The ball is is unions hands. Become team players or spectators.
Not when team player means what you want it to mean.

Last edited by 09 XBones; 12-13-2012 at 09:09 PM.
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Old 12-13-2012, 08:54 PM   #75 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by spdrcr137 View Post
What about the other side of that coin, you really think preople dont believe unions do the same thing? nepotism is alive and well even in a union shop.
Does a nonunion shop have a grievance board?
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