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Old 12-12-2012, 10:55 AM   #31 (permalink)
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compressor#v wants to know Dino or Syn?
"If the union listened to me and helped me - then great,"

So, the union didn't negotiate:
Paid vacation
Health care+ eye, dental
Profit sharing
Time and a half pay over 40 hrs.
Shift premium
Safety procedures
Retirement benefits
etc, etc,
Yea companies are benevolent and would just give you these benefits...cause they like you.
If you have them it's because unions fought for them, and if a company doesn't take care of their employees, then they'll organize. These days because of the lack of jobs, companies have their employees running scared.
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Old 12-12-2012, 01:41 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by gretsch58 View Post
Interesting video. I worked at Trenton Engine, summers during my college years. My sisters wedding reception was in that union hall.

The drinking problem isn't new. I remember the Chrysler parking lot littered with liquor bottles back then. XBones could be right, for the most part working the line is a mindless, boring job that has it's effect on people. Most hate it and look for release somewhere.

Chrysler isn't the only one with that problem. We brought a customers yard switcher into our shop for repair a few years ago. When we jacked the cab up a whiskey bottle came from behind the seat and broke the windshield. Our drivers told us the workers at that plant would sit in their cars, drinking and smoking during break. The management knew it was happening, but did nothing about it.

I know quite a few auto workers. Management, skilled trade and production. Most are good, reliable employees who work hard to help their company succeed. Some aren't.

I'm not sure right to work laws will have much immediate affect on the unions. I think it'll take a long time to put a small dent in their membership. I don't see a ton of people burning their union cards and forsaking their dues. Probably most harm will come with their organizing campaigns. And their PAC's, which some feel is the real target.
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Old 12-12-2012, 02:18 PM   #33 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by compressor#v View Post
"If the union listened to me and helped me - then great,"

So, the union didn't negotiate:
Paid vacation
Health care+ eye, dental
Profit sharing
Time and a half pay over 40 hrs.
Shift premium
Safety procedures
Retirement benefits
etc, etc,
Yea companies are benevolent and would just give you these benefits...cause they like you.
If you have them it's because unions fought for them, and if a company doesn't take care of their employees, then they'll organize. These days because of the lack of jobs, companies have their employees running scared.
My company is not union and I get all that and more...
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Old 12-12-2012, 04:31 PM   #34 (permalink)
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"My company is not union and I get all that and more..."
Explain "more" please.
If unions had never negotiated those benefits, you think your company would give them up out of the kindness of their hearts?
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Old 12-12-2012, 05:31 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by compressor#v View Post
"My company is not union and I get all that and more..."
Explain "more" please.
If unions had never negotiated those benefits, you think your company would give them up out of the kindness of their hearts?
Many companies provide significantly better benefits than that. It's called competition, you offer benefits in order to lure better employees.

Of course competition is dirty word reserved for us haters.
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Old 12-12-2012, 06:27 PM   #36 (permalink)
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FXDRYDR is reading this now saying WTF is this? FXDRYDR is reading this now saying WTF is this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by compressor#v View Post
"If the union listened to me and helped me - then great,"

So, the union didn't negotiate:
Paid vacation
Health care+ eye, dental
Profit sharing
Time and a half pay over 40 hrs.
Shift premium
Safety procedures
Retirement benefits
etc, etc,
Yea companies are benevolent and would just give you these benefits...cause they like you.
If you have them it's because unions fought for them, and if a company doesn't take care of their employees, then they'll organize. These days because of the lack of jobs, companies have their employees running scared.
You and I have been round this one before. I'll close my business before I submit to any POS union bastards telling me how to run it. If a man is doing me well, I'll do him better.

I've seen and lived enough to despise the thuggery and corruption I've seen in unions. You like them. I don't. I believe we're both entitled to our opinions and I believe we'd enjoy one another's company were we drinking beers. The end.
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Old 12-12-2012, 08:35 PM   #37 (permalink)
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Working on a drilling rig is not brain surgery either, but you can get yourself and/or others killed if you don't watch what you're doing. Its not for nothing that oil companies enforce a zero tolerance policy for drugs and alcohol on location.
As well they should, in that environment it should be zero tolerance, as well as drivers, highway construction workers, police, etc. My point is assembly line work is far too mind numbing in and of itself to worry that a worker can't perform or would place drivers or other motorists in peril as if these types of jobs equate to putting rivets into a 747...
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Old 12-12-2012, 08:41 PM   #38 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by 09 XBones


Hmmm... and what's wrong with a union charging dues to pay it's expenses?

Nothing wrong with that unless the guy paying the union dues didn't want to be in the union in the first place.


If the guy paying dues didn't want to, he's free to find employment at a nonunion shop.


Because a "right to work" law doesn't give anybody any right to work.

Quote:
Originally Posted by claytp1 View Post
Of course not, it only gives the employee the right to work without being compelled to join the union and pay dues to do so.

But you knew that didn't ya?
Nope, doesn't give either a union or a nonunion employee any right to work.
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Old 12-12-2012, 08:53 PM   #39 (permalink)
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Keep looking thru you're rose colored glasses & everything will be allright. Ya see,I'm a retired union worker, worked for the same company for 36 years, yeah I'm thankful for my pension however
However, despite the pension you still got a beef...

Quote:
my retirees insurance doesn't include eyecare or dental, and doesn't cover any innoculations, & is only good till i'm 65 & then I'll be dumpedon medicare,

Awww, guess what your nonunion counterparts have Pig? NOTHING. (Except welfare, or a job as a WalMart greeter until they keel over dead because they don't even have a pension, let alone any other kind of supplemental medical coverage.

Quote:
& oh by the way I have to buy my insurance out of my pension check. In 36 years I can't even begin to count all the good paying grievances that were traded to keep someone elses job, the one I never will forget is this one guy was fired 6 times because he wouldn't come to work, all the while guys that had good grievances were getting screwed to keep this guys job. The 7th time they fired him was because he called in and said he couldn"t find his other shoe so he couldn't come to work.
So, this is your BEST example of why unions are bad? Not bad enough to stop cashing those pension checks though huh?


Quote:
No they can't dictate where a company goes but they sure try, just ask Boeing.
They stopped Boeing because what Boeing wanted to do was against the CBA. Otherwise, the union would be powerless to stop them.

Quote:
For 36 years every election I'd get this thing in the mail telling me whoI should vote for, yeah, you guessed right it was 98% democrate,
I get politically based mail as well. What's wrong with your union suggesting who they back? ANd BTW, they're not "telling" you who to vote for, they're suggesting and YES, often a Democrat is in your best interests.

Quote:
I'm registered as non affilated, I vote for who I think will do the better job, not because they're democrate or republican.
Good for you so, why the silly example?

Quote:
Unions ain't all bad, but they have alot of problems.
Name any institution that is problem free?

Quote:
If unions are all that how come they have lost 28% of they're membership?
Because corporations have been waging war against unions since their heyday and will not stop until the entire country is making minimum wage, then they'll come out against that too.

Maybe what you fail to appreciate is that the ultimate goal of an institution whose only goal is to be as profitable as possible is not exactly in the best interests of the people who work for it.
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Old 12-12-2012, 09:05 PM   #40 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 09 XBones View Post
[i]


Nope, doesn't give either a union or a nonunion employee any right to work.
What do you work for Pelosi or something? It gives people the right to not join the union and pay dues of membership if they're given a job there. How hard is that to understand?

If that isn't what it is, what is it? Please provide proof and not your opinion.
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Old 12-12-2012, 09:08 PM   #41 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by 09 XBones View Post

Because corporations have been waging war against unions since their heyday and will not stop until the entire country is making minimum wage, then they'll come out against that too.

Maybe what you fail to appreciate is that the ultimate goal of an institution whose only goal is to be as profitable as possible is not exactly in the best interests of the people who work for it.
Or maybe the blue collar workers have concluded they're union invested dues results in less return on investment. If the unions are such a great deal for the workers than they should have no fear of right to work laws. Right to work laws do NOT make unions illegal.

I think you union guys are just being played by the Dems and your union leadership as they're afraid of losing your money.
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Old 12-12-2012, 09:18 PM   #42 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claytp1 View Post
What do you work for Pelosi or something? It gives people the right to not join the union and pay dues of membership if they're given a job there. How hard is that to understand?

If that isn't what it is, what is it? Please provide proof and not your opinion.
You misunderstand. The only "right to choose" that the left is interested in is the right to kill their own children. Every other right is reserved for the government.
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Old 12-12-2012, 09:25 PM   #43 (permalink)
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Michael Psycle is reading this now saying WTF is this?
I do not know much about right to work laws. Perhaps someone can tell me this. If a person is hired by a company that has a contract negotiated with a union in a right to work law state, and that person does not choose to join the union, does that individual get the same pay and benefits as a union person, or does that person have to negotiate on their own their wages and benefits. In other words, can a company pay a non union worker a lower wage than it pays the union workers? Or does the new hire get the same wages, benefits and work rules negotiated by the union? I'm serious in asking this.
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Old 12-12-2012, 09:30 PM   #44 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Michael Psycle View Post
I do not know much about right to work laws. Perhaps someone can tell me this. If a person is hired by a company that has a contract negotiated with a union in a right to work law state, and that person does not choose to join the union, does that individual get the same pay and benefits as a union person, or does that person have to negotiate on their own their wages and benefits. In other words, can a company pay a non union worker a lower wage than it pays the union workers? Or does the new hire get the same wages, benefits and work rules negotiated by the union? I'm serious in asking this.
The non dues paying employee would get the same pay and benefits and fall under the same negotiated workplace policies as the dues paying member. This results in workers dropping their union dues payments until the union can no longer financially exist. Once gone, the company does exactly what you see right now in ALL right-to-work states. The employees end up losing their collective bargained wages and benefits and the houses start getting razed in favor of single wide trailers.
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Old 12-12-2012, 09:36 PM   #45 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by 09 XBones View Post
The non dues paying employee would get the same pay and benefits and fall under the same negotiated workplace policies as the dues paying member. This results in workers dropping their union dues payments until the union can no longer financially exist. Once gone, the company does exactly what you see right now in ALL right-to-work states. The employees end up losing their collective bargained wages and benefits and the houses start getting razed in favor of single wide trailers.
Not even close to being the truth.
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