Sharia - Page 3 : V-Twin Forum: Harley Davidson Forums
» Sponsors

» Insurance
Go Back   V-Twin Forum : Harley-Davidson Motorcycle Forums > V-Twin Forum Non-Motorcycle Related Forums > Religion & Politics
New User? Register Forgot Password

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-04-2012, 02:22 PM   #31 (permalink)
Barney Fife - Fake Biker
 
<G Man>'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Hillbillachia
Posts: 6,287
<G Man> is still riding a stock bike <G Man> is still riding a stock bike <G Man> is still riding a stock bike
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lefty View Post
I know I won't ask you to research anything for me, G-Man, you proved your incompetence in that area with the Islam is love search. Below is the first item when I googled "koran quotes to kill infidels."

http://prophetofdoom.net/Islamic_Quotes.Islam

Your thoughts that we should seek to understand rather than, you used the word hate, I would use the words repel or deny, Islam is silly. There were those that said the same about Hitler in the '30s.

And, yes, yes, I know what is coming next, Christians were equally if not more brutal during the Crusades. As Danny Boy frequently regales us, Dems supported slavery and segregation in the past. Let's stay in the present.
Shall I point out that you found exactly what you were looking for?

I was told by others that I should understand and research Islam. I have not done enough research in a few minutes time to be an expert on anything. I do know that I will get different search results on Google if I search for "pictures" or "pictures of naked women".

I hope you are not reading in to my posts that I am somehow promoting Islam, because I am not. I have no intention of becoming a follower or trying to attract followers to the USA. I am simply trying to stir up "discussion" rather than mob mentality piling on.
__________________
G Man



Meddle not in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.



I'm an Elite Post Whore! The Evil Clown said so.

Last edited by <G Man>; 12-04-2012 at 02:26 PM.
<G Man> is online now   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 12-04-2012, 02:29 PM   #32 (permalink)
NRA Life
 
Hamilton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
Posts: 3,044
Hamilton wants to know Dino or Syn?
Quote:
Originally Posted by <G Man> View Post
If you want to pit ALL of the people in the largest group on the planet against you and hate them, you go right ahead. I think seeking out and understanding the ones who are a real threat might make for an easier battle to win.
If you want to try and understand a war that has been going on for almost 4000 years, good luck.

BTW, it will end one day, but not because of anything that man did.
__________________
"The integrity of my word, faith in the quality of my goods and in my promise, have always meant more to me than mere transitory gain."

- Robert Bosch
Hamilton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 02:42 PM   #33 (permalink)
Barney Fife - Fake Biker
 
<G Man>'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Hillbillachia
Posts: 6,287
<G Man> is still riding a stock bike <G Man> is still riding a stock bike <G Man> is still riding a stock bike
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamilton View Post
If you want to try and understand a war that has been going on for almost 4000 years, good luck.

BTW, it will end one day, but not because of anything that man did.
Good words.

I do actually understand war (somewhat). War is a emotional and violent disagreement between a very few people who have been successful at convincing many more people that they have some stake in. At some point, most of the participants have no idea what the fighting was really about, they just know what side they are on.

I think it is human nature to desire inclusion and to feel that there is more purpose and significance to our existence than what there is.
__________________
G Man



Meddle not in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.



I'm an Elite Post Whore! The Evil Clown said so.
<G Man> is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 02:46 PM   #34 (permalink)
IronButt
 
Lefty's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Redneck Country
Posts: 7,441
Lefty is reading this now saying WTF is this? Lefty is reading this now saying WTF is this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by <G Man> View Post
Shall I point out that you found exactly what you were looking for?

I was told by others that I should understand and research Islam. I have not done enough research in a few minutes time to be an expert on anything. I do know that I will get different search results on Google if I search for "pictures" or "pictures of naked women".

I hope you are not reading in to my posts that I am somehow promoting Islam, because I am not. I have no intention of becoming a follower or trying to attract followers to the USA. I am simply trying to stir up "discussion" rather than mob mentality piling on.
Pot black, kettle black, G-Man. Enough of your middle school logic. . . . You think, posted, that Islam is little different socially/culturally/spiritually than Christianity so you found flowery Koran quotes to support that. I found less than flowery Koran quotes to dispute it. That's about what happened. Stop the adolescent logic lecturing. I'm not as ignorant as you think you are clever.
__________________
To Be, Do. Descarte
To Do, Be. Sartre
Do be do be do. Sinatra
Lefty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 02:50 PM   #35 (permalink)
NRA Life
 
Hamilton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
Posts: 3,044
Hamilton wants to know Dino or Syn?
Quote:
Originally Posted by <G Man> View Post
War is a emotional and violent disagreement between a very few people...
Ain't that the truth. Governments disagree, but force the citizens to fight.
__________________
"The integrity of my word, faith in the quality of my goods and in my promise, have always meant more to me than mere transitory gain."

- Robert Bosch
Hamilton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 02:54 PM   #36 (permalink)
IronButt
 
pcarrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Indiana
Posts: 171
pcarrell wants to know Dino or Syn?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamilton View Post
If you want to try and understand a war that has been going on for almost 4000 years, good luck.

BTW, it will end one day, but not because of anything that man did.
Actually, it's really quite easy to understand the root of the problem. In the Bible you'll find a guy named Abraham. God tells Abraham that he and his decedents can have the promised land (basically, the middle east). Abraham has a son, his first son, with his wife's servant girl, and they name him Ishmael (this was an accepted tradition in that day....if the wife couldn't conceive, she appointed a servant to "stand in" for her). He then has a second son with his wife and they name him Isaac (they thought she was barren, but apparently they were wrong). Jealousies get out of control and Abraham sends the servant girl and her son away. Ishmael grows up, and through the course of time he becomes an ancestor of Mohamed, who, as we know is the founder of Islam. When Abraham dies, tradition of the times say that the first born son gets most of the stuff from his father. Isaac get's the blessing though, and he is in the ancestry of the Jewish people.

The Jew's settle the promised land and the ancestors of what would become the Muslims take a back seat. It leaves a sour taste in their mouth, and 4000 years of fighting ensue.

That's the Cliff Notes version.......

And BTW, the Crusades were all about the Christians fighting to get back the promised land from the Muslim's after they took over for a time.

Now, as to all the stuff that's happened since then, that's a little tougher to wade through.

The whole thing is nasty business really.

Last edited by pcarrell; 12-04-2012 at 03:20 PM.
pcarrell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 03:17 PM   #37 (permalink)
Barney Fife - Fake Biker
 
<G Man>'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Hillbillachia
Posts: 6,287
<G Man> is still riding a stock bike <G Man> is still riding a stock bike <G Man> is still riding a stock bike
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lefty View Post
Pot black, kettle black, G-Man. Enough of your middle school logic. . . . You think, posted, that Islam is little different socially/culturally/spiritually than Christianity so you found flowery Koran quotes to support that. I found less than flowery Koran quotes to dispute it. That's about what happened. Stop the adolescent logic lecturing. I'm not as ignorant as you think you are clever.
No need to get upset.

I'm not lecturing or trying to be clever, nor do I think you are ignorant.

I did not search for "flowery quotes", I searched for Islam in general and found many pages explaining the "misconceptions of Muslims". I'm sure those pages are strategically placed there and paid for by certain groups who want those pages to be found as are all top hits in Google. I believe they are called "ad-words". Anybody can pay for results in Google so I would certainly not consider a search there to be impartial by any means.

Just for the record, I did not say that they were "little different socially/culturally/spiritually ". What I said was that there are similarities.
__________________
G Man



Meddle not in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.



I'm an Elite Post Whore! The Evil Clown said so.
<G Man> is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 03:20 PM   #38 (permalink)
IronButt
 
Lefty's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Redneck Country
Posts: 7,441
Lefty is reading this now saying WTF is this? Lefty is reading this now saying WTF is this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by <G Man> View Post
No need to get upset.

I'm not lecturing or trying to be clever, nor do I think you are ignorant.

I did not search for "flowery quotes", I searched for Islam in general and found many pages explaining the "misconceptions of Muslims". I'm sure those pages are strategically placed there and paid for by certain groups who want those pages to be found as are all top hits in Google. I believe they are called "ad-words". Anybody can pay for results in Google so I would certainly not consider a search there to be impartial by any means.

Just for the record, I did not say that they were "little different socially/culturally/spiritually ". What I said was that there are similarities.
There are similarities between black and white. Both are described as colors by humans. You're parsing like a politician.
__________________
To Be, Do. Descarte
To Do, Be. Sartre
Do be do be do. Sinatra
Lefty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 03:21 PM   #39 (permalink)
Barney Fife - Fake Biker
 
<G Man>'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Hillbillachia
Posts: 6,287
<G Man> is still riding a stock bike <G Man> is still riding a stock bike <G Man> is still riding a stock bike
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lefty View Post
There are similarities between black and white. Both are described as colors by humans. You're parsing like a politician.
Not parsing. I gave a clear explanation of what similarities I see.
__________________
G Man



Meddle not in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.



I'm an Elite Post Whore! The Evil Clown said so.
<G Man> is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 03:32 PM   #40 (permalink)
DJW
IronButt
 
DJW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: A Country Road in Central NY
Posts: 19,450
DJW is reading this now saying WTF is this? DJW is reading this now saying WTF is this?
Pope Benedict was almost "crucified" for even using this quote in a completely benign context, but you can't deny that what the original author said is as true today as it was 6 centuries ago:

Quote:
Emperor Manual II Paleologos of the Byzantine Empire: "Show me just what Muhammad brought that was new and there you will find things only 'evil and inhuman,' such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached."
That is not to absolve any religion, past or present, for the same fault: conversion by the sword is wrong by whomever practices it.

However, here 6 centuries later, do we see a religion that continues to convert, or prevent conversion by the sword? We do if we look at the ring of "fire" that surrounds the Islamic world. From within and at every border, the Islamic world is at war.

IMO, that is inherent in their religious tradition. As Lefty put so well, the proper means of evangelism is to make your case, and if someone doesn't care to hear it, you "shake the dust from your sandals" and move on. Conversion by the sword is acceptable practice in Islam...and IMO, there is a fundamental reason for it that should not be whitewashed in the name of "tolerance."

If you read the Pope's lecture, in it's proper context, you'll see that he wasn't even referring to Islam, but rather to a discussion between the Emperor and a Persian in regards to the need for conversion through rationale discussion instead of threats of violence.

His reward for even using that quote was threats of violence. So much for rationale discussion.
__________________
a PENNY for your thoughts
DJW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 03:41 PM   #41 (permalink)
Barney Fife - Fake Biker
 
<G Man>'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Hillbillachia
Posts: 6,287
<G Man> is still riding a stock bike <G Man> is still riding a stock bike <G Man> is still riding a stock bike
Quote:
Originally Posted by DJW View Post
IMO, that is inherent in their religious tradition. As Lefty put so well, the proper means of evangelism is to make your case, and if someone doesn't care to hear it, you "shake the dust from your sandals" and move on. Conversion by the sword is acceptable practice in Islam...and IMO, there is a fundamental reason for it that should not be whitewashed in the name of "tolerance."
To a Mexican, the USA might look like a place of refuge that offers a new beginning and free health care. The taking in of illegal Mexican immigrants has become "acceptable practice" here. Does that mean that all of us citizens see it the same way?
__________________
G Man



Meddle not in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.



I'm an Elite Post Whore! The Evil Clown said so.
<G Man> is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 03:43 PM   #42 (permalink)
IronButt
 
Tequila SG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Under a palm tree in Sunny South Florida
Posts: 1,091
Tequila SG wants to know Dino or Syn?
Quote:
Originally Posted by <G Man> View Post
Not parsing. I gave a clear explanation of what similarities I see.
That's the problem you're seeing similarities where there are none.
__________________
My dream is of a place and a time where America will once again be seen as the last best hope of earth.
Abraham Lincoln




Tequila SG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 03:51 PM   #43 (permalink)
IronButt
 
pcarrell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Indiana
Posts: 171
pcarrell wants to know Dino or Syn?
Quote:
Originally Posted by <G Man> View Post
To a Mexican, the USA might look like a place of refuge that offers a new beginning and free health care. The taking in of illegal Mexican immigrants has become "acceptable practice" here. Does that mean that all of us citizens see it the same way?
I've been following along with this conversation fairly well so far, but ya lost me here. Care to expand on this thought and it's connection to the topic?

You highlighted the words "Conversion by the sword is acceptable practice in Islam" in your quote, and maybe I'm just a little slow today, but I'm not seeing the connection.

Last edited by pcarrell; 12-04-2012 at 03:54 PM.
pcarrell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 03:58 PM   #44 (permalink)
DJW
IronButt
 
DJW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: A Country Road in Central NY
Posts: 19,450
DJW is reading this now saying WTF is this? DJW is reading this now saying WTF is this?
Quote:
Originally Posted by <G Man> View Post
To a Mexican, the USA might look like a place of refuge that offers a new beginning and free health care. The taking in of illegal Mexican immigrants has become "acceptable practice" here. Does that mean that all of us citizens see it the same way?
Sorry, but you're missing the point I think.

What I am saying is that conversion by the sword is fundamentally a part of Islamic practice.

Now, I'm sure there are "Muslims" that don't ascribe to that, but then there are "Christians" that don't ascribe to much of what Christianity teaches as well.

That's not the point of the thread...which is a discussion of Sharia not "sharia-lite."
__________________
a PENNY for your thoughts
DJW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2012, 04:49 PM   #45 (permalink)
Barney Fife - Fake Biker
 
<G Man>'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Hillbillachia
Posts: 6,287
<G Man> is still riding a stock bike <G Man> is still riding a stock bike <G Man> is still riding a stock bike
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcarrell View Post
I've been following along with this conversation fairly well so far, but ya lost me here. Care to expand on this thought and it's connection to the topic?

You highlighted the words "Conversion by the sword is acceptable practice in Islam" in your quote, and maybe I'm just a little slow today, but I'm not seeing the connection.
The intended connection was that what happens on the inside does not always get reflected accurately by outward appearance. Just because our government seems to think we should be welcoming in illegals and even providing them with benefits, I don't think that viewpoint is shared by a majority of US citizens. Likewise, the extreme beliefs and actions of Islamic leaders who have military power should not necessarily be assumed to be shared amongst ALL Muslims IMO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DJW View Post
Sorry, but you're missing the point I think.

What I am saying is that conversion by the sword is fundamentally a part of Islamic practice.

Now, I'm sure there are "Muslims" that don't ascribe to that, but then there are "Christians" that don't ascribe to much of what Christianity teaches as well.

That's not the point of the thread...which is a discussion of Sharia not "sharia-lite."
Fair enough. But the OP seemed to be in favor of converting to Sharia (surely in jest).

The discussion naturally drifted to Muslims in general (actually with posts by you and FXDRYDR). I was just going with the flow.
__________________
G Man



Meddle not in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.



I'm an Elite Post Whore! The Evil Clown said so.
<G Man> is online now   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are On


Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.2

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:45 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0
(C)2001-2012 V-twinForum.com All Rights Reserved (C)2001- V-twinForum.com All Rights Reserved
Motorcycle News, Videos and Reviews
Honda Grom Forum Harley Davidson Forum Honda 600RR Kawasaki Forum Yamaha R6 Forum Yamaha FZ-09 Forum
1199 Panigale Forum Roadglide Forum Honda CBR1000 Forum Vulcan Forum Yamaha R1 Forum Yamaha R3 Forum
Ducati Monster Forum Harley Forums Honda CBR250R Forum ZX10R Forum Star Raider Forum Yamaha Viking Forum
Suzuki GSXR Forum V-Rod Forums Honda Shadow Forum Kawasaki Motorcycle Forum Star Warrior Forum KTM Duke 390 Forum
SV650 Forum BMW S1000RR Forum Honda Fury Forum Kawasaki Versys Forum Drag Racing Forum Ducati 899 Panigale Forum
Suzuki V-Strom BMW K1600 Triumph Forum Victory Forums Sportbikes BMW NineT Forum
Volusia Forum BMW F800 Forum Triumph 675 Forum MV Agusta Forum HD Street Forum Suzuki GW250 Forum
Yamaha Motorcycles Victory Gunner Forum Honda Vultus Forum HD LiveWire Forum