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Old 11-15-2012, 09:12 PM   #61 (permalink)
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Show me where I mentioned race.
I said you and UT brought up race and gender. You the gender part (skirt), UT the race.

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Old 11-15-2012, 09:19 PM   #62 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Gunny4Sawx View Post
Ahh, good old Casey devaluing life. After all those folks were only in what their 366th trimester or so?
Cut the crap, Gunney. This is about Obama. Nothing more. Again, I didn't hear you complain about the thousands of American deaths in the Iraq War. And that was at least as big a screw up as Benghazi. But of course, the Right said squat. In fact, they chuckled when Bush did a joke video running around the White House "looking" for WMD. It was a joke to him. Of course, Obama wasn't president. You Right Wingers have no clue how transparent you are. But the country is starting to get the idea. You're like the little boy who cried wolf. After a while, no one listens to your complaints.
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Old 11-16-2012, 05:11 AM   #63 (permalink)
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Cut the crap, Gunney. This is about Obama. Nothing more. Again, I didn't hear you complain about the thousands of American deaths in the Iraq War. And that was at least as big a screw up as Benghazi. But of course, the Right said squat. In fact, they chuckled when Bush did a joke video running around the White House "looking" for WMD. It was a joke to him. Of course, Obama wasn't president. You Right Wingers have no clue how transparent you are. But the country is starting to get the idea. You're like the little boy who cried wolf. After a while, no one listens to your complaints.
Really Casey??? What Bush did or did not do in his 8 years has no bearing on Benghazi. I would have a hard time finding many positive things to talk about concerning Bush's terms. But one has nothing to do with the othe.

You can't jusity and/or rationalize bad (irresponsible) behavior by comparing it to other bad (irresponsible) behavior.

Of course this about Obama and his continued failure and inability to be a leader. Now Obama has blood on his hands and won't be man enough to stand up and admit it was his fault. He is nothing more than a worthless pol. And sadly the families of those 4 dead Americans deserved so much more than " uh well uh it's under investigation". That is disgracful.

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Old 11-16-2012, 08:05 AM   #64 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Casey0211 View Post
Of course, I haven't answered the questions to your satisfaction, UT -- facts are completely irrelevant to you.

I have read both transcripts. I just don't live in the alternate Planet Wingnut universe where "acts of terror" and "terrorism" are different things.

I don't doubt there were screw ups concerning Bengazhi. But no one who would tap Sarah Palin to be VP or carry water for George Bush on Iraq and the non-existent WMD or ignored warnings about 911 should be talking so loud about Susan Rice and deaths at Benghazi. How many thousands of Americans died as a result of McCain and Graham's cheerleading?

Maybe McCain should take time away from giving BS press conferences and go to briefings. He might actually learn something and pass it along to you

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics...er-benghazi-2/
Quote:
Yesterday, four of these extraordinary Americans were killed in an attack on our diplomatic post in Benghazi. Among those killed was our Ambassador, Chris Stevens, as well as Foreign Service Officer Sean Smith. We are still notifying the families of the others who were killed. And today, the American people stand united in holding the families of the four Americans in our thoughts and in our prayers.

The United States condemns in the strongest terms this outrageous and shocking attack. We're working with the government of Libya to secure our diplomats. I've also directed my administration to increase our security at diplomatic posts around the world. And make no mistake, we will work with the Libyan government to bring to justice the killers who attacked our people.

Since our founding, the United States has been a nation that respects all faiths. We reject all efforts to denigrate the religious beliefs of others. But there is absolutely no justification to this type of senseless violence. None. The world must stand together to unequivocally reject these brutal acts.

Already, many Libyans have joined us in doing so, and this attack will not break the bonds between the United States and Libya. Libyan security personnel fought back against the attackers alongside Americans. Libyans helped some of our diplomats find safety, and they carried Ambassador Stevens’s body to the hospital, where we tragically learned that he had died.

It's especially tragic that Chris Stevens died in Benghazi because it is a city that he helped to save. At the height of the Libyan revolution, Chris led our diplomatic post in Benghazi. With characteristic skill, courage, and resolve, he built partnerships with Libyan revolutionaries, and helped them as they planned to build a new Libya. When the Qaddafi regime came to an end, Chris was there to serve as our ambassador to the new Libya, and he worked tirelessly to support this young democracy, and I think both Secretary Clinton and I relied deeply on his knowledge of the situation on the ground there. He was a role model to all who worked with him and to the young diplomats who aspire to walk in his footsteps.

Along with his colleagues, Chris died in a country that is still striving to emerge from the recent experience of war. Today, the loss of these four Americans is fresh, but our memories of them linger on. I have no doubt that their legacy will live on through the work that they did far from our shores and in the hearts of those who love them back home.

Of course, yesterday was already a painful day for our nation as we marked the solemn memory of the 9/11 attacks. We mourned with the families who were lost on that day. I visited the graves of troops who made the ultimate sacrifice in Iraq and Afghanistan at the hallowed grounds of Arlington Cemetery, and had the opportunity to say thank you and visit some of our wounded warriors at Walter Reed. And then last night, we learned the news of this attack in Benghazi.

As Americans, let us never, ever forget that our freedom is only sustained because there are people who are willing to fight for it, to stand up for it, and in some cases, lay down their lives for it. Our country is only as strong as the character of our people and the service of those both civilian and military who represent us around the globe.

No acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation, alter that character, or eclipse the light of the values that we stand for. Today we mourn four more Americans who represent the very best of the United States of America. We will not waver in our commitment to see that justice is done for this terrible act. And make no mistake, justice will be done.

But we also know that the lives these Americans led stand in stark contrast to those of their attackers. These four Americans stood up for freedom and human dignity. They should give every American great pride in the country that they served, and the hope that our flag represents to people around the globe who also yearn to live in freedom and with dignity.

We grieve with their families, but let us carry on their memory, and let us continue their work of seeking a stronger America and a better world for all of our children.

Thank you. May God bless the memory of those we lost and may God bless the United States of America.
Above is the full transcript of Obama's statement in the Rose Garden on the morning of 9/12/2012 just before he flew off to New York and Las Vegas for fund raisers and to record the Letterman show. Please show us where Obama mentioned "terrorism" in reference to the Benghazi attack?

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press....sident-deaths-...
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Old 11-16-2012, 11:17 AM   #65 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by utrvp View Post

Quote:
Quote:
Yesterday, four of these extraordinary Americans were killed in an attack on our diplomatic post in Benghazi. Among those killed was our Ambassador, Chris Stevens, as well as Foreign Service Officer Sean Smith. We are still notifying the families of the others who were killed. And today, the American people stand united in holding the families of the four Americans in our thoughts and in our prayers.

The United States condemns in the strongest terms this outrageous and shocking attack. We're working with the government of Libya to secure our diplomats. I've also directed my administration to increase our security at diplomatic posts around the world. And make no mistake, we will work with the Libyan government to bring to justice the killers who attacked our people.

Since our founding, the United States has been a nation that respects all faiths. We reject all efforts to denigrate the religious beliefs of others. But there is absolutely no justification to this type of senseless violence. None. The world must stand together to unequivocally reject these brutal acts.

Already, many Libyans have joined us in doing so, and this attack will not break the bonds between the United States and Libya. Libyan security personnel fought back against the attackers alongside Americans. Libyans helped some of our diplomats find safety, and they carried Ambassador Stevens’s body to the hospital, where we tragically learned that he had died.

It's especially tragic that Chris Stevens died in Benghazi because it is a city that he helped to save. At the height of the Libyan revolution, Chris led our diplomatic post in Benghazi. With characteristic skill, courage, and resolve, he built partnerships with Libyan revolutionaries, and helped them as they planned to build a new Libya. When the Qaddafi regime came to an end, Chris was there to serve as our ambassador to the new Libya, and he worked tirelessly to support this young democracy, and I think both Secretary Clinton and I relied deeply on his knowledge of the situation on the ground there. He was a role model to all who worked with him and to the young diplomats who aspire to walk in his footsteps.

Along with his colleagues, Chris died in a country that is still striving to emerge from the recent experience of war. Today, the loss of these four Americans is fresh, but our memories of them linger on. I have no doubt that their legacy will live on through the work that they did far from our shores and in the hearts of those who love them back home.

Of course, yesterday was already a painful day for our nation as we marked the solemn memory of the 9/11 attacks. We mourned with the families who were lost on that day. I visited the graves of troops who made the ultimate sacrifice in Iraq and Afghanistan at the hallowed grounds of Arlington Cemetery, and had the opportunity to say thank you and visit some of our wounded warriors at Walter Reed. And then last night, we learned the news of this attack in Benghazi.

As Americans, let us never, ever forget that our freedom is only sustained because there are people who are willing to fight for it, to stand up for it, and in some cases, lay down their lives for it. Our country is only as strong as the character of our people and the service of those both civilian and military who represent us around the globe.

No acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation, alter that character, or eclipse the light of the values that we stand for. Today we mourn four more Americans who represent the very best of the United States of America. We will not waver in our commitment to see that justice is done for this terrible act. And make no mistake, justice will be done.

But we also know that the lives these Americans led stand in stark contrast to those of their attackers. These four Americans stood up for freedom and human dignity. They should give every American great pride in the country that they served, and the hope that our flag represents to people around the globe who also yearn to live in freedom and with dignity.

We grieve with their families, but let us carry on their memory, and let us continue their work of seeking a stronger America and a better world for all of our children.

Thank you. May God bless the memory of those we lost and may God bless the United States of America.


Above is the full transcript of Obama's statement in the Rose Garden on the morning of 9/12/2012 just before he flew off to New York and Las Vegas for fund raisers and to record the Letterman show. Please show us where Obama mentioned "terrorism" in reference to the Benghazi attack?
You are playing a game of semantics UT. We get the gist of your complaint. As Michael tends to do frequently, you are starting to UNSELL your point.

Are you admitting that you are too dense to to understand that an "act of terror" IS "terrorism"?
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Old 11-16-2012, 12:25 PM   #66 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by <G Man> View Post
You are playing a game of semantics UT. We get the gist of your complaint. As Michael tends to do frequently, you are starting to UNSELL your point.

Are you admitting that you are too dense to to understand that an "act of terror" IS "terrorism"?
I understand that perfectly well but you can't just take a few words and use them to make a point. You have to have context. For one thing the exact words were "acts of terror" not "act of terror" which were not specifically directed to any one specific event, i.e. Benghazi. That little letter "s" makes a big difference! That is why I posted the entire transcript and not just one line. We now know that Obama knew within just a couple hours or sooner that Al Qaeda was involved and that it was not a spontaneous riot sparked by a video. Five days after the Rose Garden announcement, Obama sent out Susan Rice with a phoney story about a video being responsible for the riot. Obama never mentioned Al Qaeda and neither did Susan Rice. For about two weeks or more they stuck with the story that this was a spontaneous riot and not a terrorist attack! Today we found out the fact Al Qaeda was involved and was in the original talking points provided by the CIA provided the White House that Susan Rice was supposed to go on national television with however the White House removed that fact from the talking points! Why?

Getting back to your point Obama never specifically declared Benghazi a terrorist attack and I am not sure he has to this day!

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2...-Qaeda-Element
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Old 11-16-2012, 01:01 PM   #67 (permalink)
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I understand that perfectly well but you can't just take a few words and use them to make a point. You have to have context. For one thing the exact words were "acts of terror" not "act of terror" which were not specifically directed to any one specific event, i.e. Benghazi. That little letter "s" makes a big difference! That is why I posted the entire transcript and not just one line. We now know that Obama knew within just a couple hours or sooner that Al Qaeda was involved and that it was not a spontaneous riot sparked by a video. Five days after the Rose Garden announcement, Obama sent out Susan Rice with a phoney story about a video being responsible for the riot. Obama never mentioned Al Qaeda and neither did Susan Rice. For about two weeks or more they stuck with the story that this was a spontaneous riot and not a terrorist attack! Today we found out the fact Al Qaeda was involved and was in the original talking points provided by the CIA provided the White House that Susan Rice was supposed to go on national television with however the White House removed that fact from the talking points! Why?

Getting back to your point Obama never specifically declared Benghazi a terrorist attack and I am not sure he has to this day!

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Peace/2...-Qaeda-Element
I'm not trying to defend the administration's actions, but being realistic, I have a couple of thoughts on this.

One is that the "context" is the entire transcript that you posted which was indeed concerning the Benghazi attack. So, if not referring to this specifically as an act of terror, then what would you propose was meant by that sentence?

Secondly, although I am not a big proponent of government keeping secrets from the public, I would admit that there certainly are times when it could be warranted. I could see an announcement of an Al Qaeda attack on a US Embassy on 9-11 conjuring up a lot of panic here in the states. People act stupidly enough under normal circumstances never mind in a panic. That does not excuse the continuation of the concealment, but I suppose it is what it is.

You seem to be proposing that somehow Obama did not care that this happened or stood to benefit somehow by hiding it. I do not have enough inside knowledge to agree or disagree with you on that, but I have my doubts that this is truly the case.

I purposely do not "tune in" to the MSM that I keep hearing comaplaints about because there is so much information (and misinformation) out there that it becomes difficult for anyone to sort out what is real and what is not. There are few facts and a lot of speculation available for this and most other incidents. I try to let the facts trickle through before I grab my pitch fork and torch and run out the door of my hut.
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Old 11-16-2012, 01:51 PM   #68 (permalink)
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I heard Obama defending Susan Rice in his press conference yesterday about comments by John McCain and Lindsey Graham. He said, "If Sen. McCain and Sen. Graham and others want to go after somebody, they should go after me," Obama said. "And I'm happy to have that discussion with them. But for them to go after the U.N. ambassador? Who had nothing to do with Benghazi? And was simply making a presentation based on intelligence that she had received? To besmirch her reputation is outrageous." This begs a couple of questions. One if she knew nothing about what happened in Benghazi, which is what Obama said, why was she sent out to 5 Sunday news programs to answer questions on Benghazi? Also if the answers she gave were based on information the White House gave her, why was she spreading a story about a video that we know the White House already knew was false? Also why did Obama seem so outraged? He didn't seem outraged at the attack that killed Ambassador Stevens an aide and two Navy Seals. Almost sounded like he wanted to fight! Think maybe he has a little something going on on the side with Susan Rice?
Your saying there was no video? There were violence in other Countries at the same time over this Muslim video.

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Old 11-16-2012, 02:03 PM   #69 (permalink)
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Your saying there was no video? There were violence in other Countries at the same time over this Muslim video.

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Did those other countries attack our embassy in Benghazi too?
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Old 11-16-2012, 03:09 PM   #70 (permalink)
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Cut the crap, Gunney. This is about Obama. Nothing more. Again, I didn't hear you complain about the thousands of American deaths in the Iraq War. And that was at least as big a screw up as Benghazi. But of course, the Right said squat. In fact, they chuckled when Bush did a joke video running around the White House "looking" for WMD. It was a joke to him. Of course, Obama wasn't president. You Right Wingers have no clue how transparent you are. But the country is starting to get the idea. You're like the little boy who cried wolf. After a while, no one listens to your complaints.
You left wing extremists make me chuckle at your false indignation. I could show you the background to the computer I'm at present typing on and you would know the names of 7 heroes and see the hill on which they died. If you could pass a security screening I could show you the pictures which hang inside my locker at work of a truly great young man who lost his life far to early to his true potential. You however seem like the type of guy who honks his horn and cuts into a funeral procession on it's way to a national cemetery to bury a young man or woman who lived life beyond anything you could imagine in your small minded pathetic little insular lifestyle.
Nice parry BTW bringing up Bush, what a hoot you simpleminded folks are. It's like waving a set of keys in front of a baby to distract them from the teething pain.
In order to have heard my opinion on Iraq and the plan to go into it in October of 2002 you would have had to be sitting in a conference room next to me. But again oh great soothsayer you weren't. I look forward to your emoting an assigning my feelings to me in your rebuttal as if you know how anything or anyone but your own self(ish) thinks.
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Old 11-16-2012, 05:01 PM   #71 (permalink)
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I'm not trying to defend the administration's actions, but being realistic, I have a couple of thoughts on this.

One is that the "context" is the entire transcript that you posted which was indeed concerning the Benghazi attack. So, if not referring to this specifically as an act of terror, then what would you propose was meant by that sentence?

Secondly, although I am not a big proponent of government keeping secrets from the public, I would admit that there certainly are times when it could be warranted. I could see an announcement of an Al Qaeda attack on a US Embassy on 9-11 conjuring up a lot of panic here in the states. People act stupidly enough under normal circumstances never mind in a panic. That does not excuse the continuation of the concealment, but I suppose it is what it is.

You seem to be proposing that somehow Obama did not care that this happened or stood to benefit somehow by hiding it. I do not have enough inside knowledge to agree or disagree with you on that, but I have my doubts that this is truly the case.

I purposely do not "tune in" to the MSM that I keep hearing comaplaints about because there is so much information (and misinformation) out there that it becomes difficult for anyone to sort out what is real and what is not. There are few facts and a lot of speculation available for this and most other incidents. I try to let the facts trickle through before I grab my pitch fork and torch and run out the door of my hut.
You don't seriously believe Obama was concerned about citizens panicing do you? Why would anyone in the U.S. panic over an attack in Libya when most of us knew from the outset it was Al Qaeda! It was 9/11 for crying out loud! Security should have already been beefed up but instead it was turned over to Libyians who abandoned the Embassy and allowed the attack to carry on.

As to how Obama benefited by keeping it hushed up that it was a terrorist attack as opposed to a spontaneous uprising, did you forget there was an election going on? Obama and Biden had been running around the country spiking the ball and boasting GM is alive and OBL is dead. They kept reminding us Al Qaeda was all but destroyed and no longer a threat. So how do you think it would it look if in the middle of all that spiking and boasting Our Ambassodor and three other Americans were killed in an Al Qaeda attack on our Embassy on a day when we should have been prepared for just such an attack? Also how would it look if instead of being prepared for a predictable attack, we were caught with our pants down exactly as we were? You don't think that something like that may have changed the outcome of the election had it not been covered up and make no mistake about it, it was a coverup!
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Old 11-17-2012, 09:33 AM   #72 (permalink)
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You left out the truth of why Susan Rice was chosen to spread the word. She is black and she is a woman. Anyone who questions anything she said is hit with both the race card and the Republicans hate women card at the same time. Otherwise you provided no answers to the question. As Obama told Candy Crowley, get the transcript. Obama did not refer to the Benghazi attack as an act of terrorism. The only time terrorism was mentioned was in a generic sense in reference to the 9/11 attacks. Your statement has no value as it is not accurate!
As I predicted, from USA Today, "All of the things they have disliked about things that have gone on in the administration, they have never called a male unqualified, not bright, not trustworthy," said Rep. Marcia Fudge, the next chairwoman of the Congressional Black Caucus. "There is a clear sexism and racism that goes with these comments being made by unfortunately Sen. McCain and others." Also from Hardball with Chris Matthews via Gateway Pundit, Rep. James Clyburn (D-SC) played the race card on Susan Rice critics: “They are attacking this young African-American woman…” According to Clyburn, it’s not that she’s incompetent and dense, it’s that she’s black that Republicans are going after her.


http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/p...libya/1710683/

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012...critics-video/
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Old 11-17-2012, 10:11 AM   #73 (permalink)
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You don't seriously believe Obama was concerned about citizens panicing do you? Why would anyone in the U.S. panic over an attack in Libya when most of us knew from the outset it was Al Qaeda! It was 9/11 for crying out loud! Security should have already been beefed up but instead it was turned over to Libyians who abandoned the Embassy and allowed the attack to carry on.

As to how Obama benefited by keeping it hushed up that it was a terrorist attack as opposed to a spontaneous uprising, did you forget there was an election going on? Obama and Biden had been running around the country spiking the ball and boasting GM is alive and OBL is dead. They kept reminding us Al Qaeda was all but destroyed and no longer a threat. So how do you think it would it look if in the middle of all that spiking and boasting Our Ambassodor and three other Americans were killed in an Al Qaeda attack on our Embassy on a day when we should have been prepared for just such an attack? Also how would it look if instead of being prepared for a predictable attack, we were caught with our pants down exactly as we were? You don't think that something like that may have changed the outcome of the election had it not been covered up and make no mistake about it, it was a coverup!
I don't claim to know what Obama or any of his advisors are or were concerned about. I was merely looking at the situation from a reasonable viewpoint rather than the normal view of predetermined hatred.

The attack was on 9/11. The election was on 11/6. The "truth" came out long before the election and I don't see where it had any ill effect on Obama's campaign. There is no need for me to speculate about something that I have already seen the result of.

You speak of Obama's campaigning as if Romney was running an open and honest, non-mudslinging campaign. I see no difference between the way the two of them ran for office. Both campaigns were dispicable, neither more than the other.

Unless you have some source of inside information that the general public does not have access to, I think you are casting "blame" on politicians for something that the people of this country are actually to blame for. Everyone else in this country had access to the same information that you did and you were able to "figure it out" right? Are you upset because the MSM is preying on all of us who are lesser people than you and not able to think for ourselves? Is that the stance you are taking, the position of looking out for all of us idiots?
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Old 11-17-2012, 11:30 AM   #74 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by <G Man> View Post
I don't claim to know what Obama or any of his advisors are or were concerned about. I was merely looking at the situation from a reasonable viewpoint rather than the normal view of predetermined hatred.

The attack was on 9/11. The election was on 11/6. The "truth" came out long before the election and I don't see where it had any ill effect on Obama's campaign. There is no need for me to speculate about something that I have already seen the result of.

You speak of Obama's campaigning as if Romney was running an open and honest, non-mudslinging campaign. I see no difference between the way the two of them ran for office. Both campaigns were dispicable, neither more than the other.

Unless you have some source of inside information that the general public does not have access to, I think you are casting "blame" on politicians for something that the people of this country are actually to blame for. Everyone else in this country had access to the same information that you did and you were able to "figure it out" right? Are you upset because the MSM is preying on all of us who are lesser people than you and not able to think for ourselves? Is that the stance you are taking, the position of looking out for all of us idiots?
You are naive if you think the truth came out prior to the election. The truth still hasn't come out and is only just starting to come out. Fox News and Conservative talk radio was trying to get as much as they could out but the MSM was pretty much ignoring the story. Even Fox News didn't know most of what happened. More has come out since the election than came out before it. Yesterday we learned that the story Susan Rice was sent out to tell was altered by this administration and the fact they new it was Al Qaeda from the git go was remioved from the talking points given them by the CIA. Do you not wonder why they did that? There is still more to come. Like I said this is a coverup. You can choose to believe or not to believe that whichever you choose, I don't care! Susan Rice was a tool of this administration. She was picked not for what she knew, Obama admitted she had nothing to do with Behghazi, but for her race and gender. That way when her statements were challenged they could distract from the truth by crying racist and sexist wich is exactly what I said they would do and they are doing right now!

I mentioned nothing about Romney because he was a candidate for the Presidency, not the President. He had no power to do anything leading up to 9/11, during the attack or after the attack. He had no involvment in Behghazi at all so whatever campaign he ran has no bearing on the topic of Benghazi!

Whether you are an idiot or not is for you to determine. I never called you or anyone else an idiot. The fact is however this election was more about who was the more likeable candidate than about who was the best qualified candidate. It was a popularity contest. Way too many voters had no idea what either candidate stood for or what they could or would do for our country. Most of them do not look beyond the evening news or the Letterman show to learn the issues. They vote more based on who they would rather have a beer with than who is the best choice for our country! If I did that perhaps I too would have voted for Obama. I realize it is going to require some hard choices to fix what is wrong for our country. I felt Mitt Romney was far more likely to make those choices than Obama was. I don't believe in 4 years Obama has made a single difficult choice. Can you name any?
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Laws that forbid the carrying of arms… disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes… Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man. -Jefferson’s “Commonplace Book,” 1774_1776, quoting from On Crimes and Punishment, by criminologist Cesare Beccaria, 1764
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Old 11-17-2012, 12:03 PM   #75 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by utrvp View Post
. I don't believe in 4 years Obama has made a single difficult choice. Can you name any?
9 iron or wedge.
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