Electric starter shaft

[MilesToGo]

Can someone tell me if there is suppose to be a spacer of some sort on the starter shaft. I was looking at a new primary cover for my 1980 Low Rider and it says it comes with bearing spacers for the starter shaft. I've pulled my current primary cover off a few times and I know there's no spacers on the starter shaft that slides into the primary cover. I've also noticed that the starter shaft assembly fells really loose - of course this is when the cover is off and the shaft is not supported - but I'm pretty sure that's what I hear rattling around inside the primary when I'm riding. Any advice would be appreciated.

[Casper HD]

there should be a spacer on the starter shaft it works like a thrust washer when your starter engages it also works to keep your starter gear and ring gear in alinement.

[newultraclassic]

Originally Posted by Casper HD

there should be a spacer on the starter shaft it works like a thrust washer when your starter engages it also works to keep your starter gear and ring gear in alinement.

Casper is quite correct. There should be a spacer on the end inside end of the starter shaft right next to the large starter shaft gear (inside the starter shaft housing). It's somewhere around 3/16 inch thick. You can use grease to hold it there during assembly. When I bought my 1980 FXS someone had left that out and it eventually ruined the clutch basket starter ring gear. Funny thing is that I can't find one in the 1971-1984 parts book. That's not the only part missing in the HD Shovelhead parts book, by the way.

However, I just looked in my FL/FX Service Book (1978 1/2 to 1984) and the spacer shows up in the diagram on page 5-16. The problem would be finding a part number for it. The text describing the assembly says that it's optional ("if used")

There should also be a thin flat spacer on the outside end of the starter shaft where the shaft enters the outer primary cover. What I finally did on my bike was to assemble the primary gasket and outer primary case with the clutch backet out and the derby cover off. With all of the spacers in place, I reached in with a feeler gauge and checked to see that I had no more than .020 end play on the starter shaft. That was about 10 years ago and I'm still on the replacement ring gear. If the shaft does not have limited end play, the Bendix gear will back out of the ring gear when starting up and this will destroy the ring gear after a while.

Some of the Starter Shaft gears have a spacer built in. The Ironhead Sportster gears are made that way and they will interchange with the Shovelhead gear if you can find one.

Hope this helps.

[The GreatTommyC]

NEWULTRA, I have the same clunk - grinding problem with my bike, I'm trying to understand where the spacers are as I've never takin off the primary cover yet. It zaps power from my battery when this happens too, which sucks because then she won't start at all.
Is the problem that the starter shaft is coming out too far or not coming out far enough? Should I pull the starter, primary cover or just the derby cover to inspect/resolve this problem.
Anybody got a trick to change the carb jet without buying the jet changing tool? My plugs foul out after a week or two. I knows she's running rich but I can't lean it out anymore or she pops on deceleration. I'm fairly sure a smaller jet is required.
Let me know guys and THANKS! for your great info.

[newultraclassic]

Originally Posted by The GreatTommyC

NEWULTRA, I have the same clunk - grinding problem with my bike, I'm trying to understand where the spacers are as I've never takin off the primary cover yet. It zaps power from my battery when this happens too, which sucks because then she won't start at all.
Is the problem that the starter shaft is coming out too far or not coming out far enough? Should I pull the starter, primary cover or just the derby cover to inspect/resolve this problem.
Anybody got a trick to change the carb jet without buying the jet changing tool? My plugs foul out after a week or two. I knows she's running rich but I can't lean it out anymore or she pops on deceleration. I'm fairly sure a smaller jet is required.
Let me know guys and THANKS! for your great info.

First, if and when you remove the primary on your Shovelhead, please disconnect the battery. That will prevent any amputation or mechanical damage.

The starter housing is behind the inner primary. Inside of the starter housing is the large reduction gear (31485-65) that mates with the gear on the end of the starter unit itself. That spacer that was missing on my bike is supposed to sit right on the outside face of that large reduction gear. As I said earlier, it's approximately 3/16". It doesn't show in the parts book but I got one from a wise old Indy friend of mine, who has now gone to the Happy Hunting Ground. He didn't tell me which Harley it was used in but it was definitely a Harley part. Apparently some bikes need them and some don't.

The bottom line is, when that spacer is in, the end clearance on the starter shaft is not very great - say .020 or so. You can fine-tune this by using a thicker washer on the end of the starter shaft where it enters the outer primary needle bearing. I adjusted my end clearance by adding the spacer on the face of the reduction gear and also using a thicker washer on the end of the starter shaft. You can check it with the clutch basket removed and primary case temporarily installed. You can reach in through the derby opening with a feeler gauge to check end clearance (remember, no battery.....)

I don't think you have to remove the inner primary to access the large reduction gear. You will have to remove the starter and loosen the reduction case so that you can slip the tin cover out of the way to look in and see if your washer is in there. If you have the washer, it will stick there with heavy grease while you install the other parts.

If your ring gear is shot, you have two choices: Either get a new basket with ring gear...or get a replacement ring gear and remove the old one with a lathe. The lathe can also be used to true up the new ring gear prior to TIG or MIG welding it in three places like the original. There are two type of ring gears...OEM is laminated and riveted out of three or so layers...I think that's the way HD replaced them but they are no longer available from HD....nor is anything else for that matter.

The A/M replacements (Chinese, of course) are one piece. They are pretty good but they are not cheap and there may be a cash tradeoff between a new basket versus a replacement ring gear since labor is involved....unless you can do it yourself like I do.

I also discovered that a sportster reduction gear from a 1970's Ironhead has a boss on the reduction gear that takes up the slack instead of the washer. So if you could find a Shovelhead Sportster reduction gear this would do the same thing as a washer. Any good indy shop will know about this issue. Remember, get the clearance down to around .020 and your ring gear will last a long time. The reason you need the washer is to set the starter shaft in the correct position. Otherwise it wil be too far in and will "wander" permitting the starter to strip the ring gear in time.

You also need to make sure that your spark is properly set. If too far advanced, it will kick back and cause the ring gear to grind as well. A single fire ignition with an electronic retard is best, IMHO.

Hope this helps


P.S. What carburetor do you have?