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Old 05-09-2005, 12:12 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Road King...Popping??? Why??/

Ok, so I've had my bike for a few months that I bought from Bartells Harley here in Marina Del Rey, CA.

I had Thunderheader installed, with the mapping (so I thought) and the high flow air filter.

Ever since I've had the bike, it's been "popping" or backfiring between first and second or second and third gear. So I take it in, and like a dealer..........they say...........nothing wrong. It happens to all Harley's. We can Dyno it for $500, but not now.

I have spoken to everyone and they say that the bike is running lean, which I thought from the beginning.

My question..........could I (they have done any damage to the motor???) I am trying to get this fixed but keep getting the shaft from these guys. I hope they didn't mess something up..........


Please let me know your thoughts.

Thanks,
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Old 05-09-2005, 01:08 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Personally, I can't stomach Bartel's. Those guys wouldn't know MSRP if they fell over it.

Everytime I shopped a bike at Bartel's, theirs would always have added "chrome packages" that jerked the price out of sight. They don't use HD accessories either, they use parts plated in Kentucky, I think it's Brown's, but not sure, and they are very proud of that chrome. They claim their chrome is the best anywhere, blah, blah, blah. I think Bartel's profit margins are the best.

Not surprised that you received, "that's normal, but we'll dyno it for $500" from those guys.

Supposedly, the guru of dyno and Power Commanders is the guy at Pomona Valley.
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Old 05-09-2005, 08:42 AM   #3 (permalink)
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You need an add on fuel module for your bike. If you are going to keep the mods fairly mild, then the DFO / Techlusion will have you fixed up in no time. Easy to operate and about $169 from online merchants. Or go to Powercommander if you want something with more stuff to play with for down the road.
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Old 05-09-2005, 07:17 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Thanks for the replies guys.

Yeah, Bartells and MSRP can not be put in the same sentence...........never, ever!!

But I actually went in yesterday and was talking to a buddy of mine in parts and he said for me to speak to a certain Master Tech in service. He also went outside, and had the guy come in.

I explained the problem to the guy and my boy says to him....."Hey, fix him up, and don't give him the it's normal answer back." The tech says, "sure thing...can you bring it in on Thursday??"

Ok, we'll see what they say. But I guarantee you 1 thing...........I'm not paying a single penny to get the bike running right!!! After the nearly 35K I have given those pr*ck$, they should have my bike running right the first time.

We need to hold our ground with these dealers and make them accountable. They are there to provide a service, just like anyone or anywhere else. We wouldn't take "it's normal" and "it's no big deal" from our car dealers service folks.........why take that answer from our bike dealers??!!

(ok, I'm off the soap box now. Sorry, and please chime in with your thoughts........ :-)
__________________
Budweiser....The King of Beers.....

Harley-Davidson.......The King of the Road
.

2006 Vivid Black Road Glide
Blacked out:
Front End
Arlen Ness Big Sucker
Wheels
PM Brakes
Wild 1 Handlebars
Lights
Mirrors
Horn
Engine: 95" Dave Mackie (it's a beast!)
It never ends!


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Old 05-11-2005, 09:28 AM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deucedog
Personally, I can't stomach Bartel's. Those guys wouldn't know MSRP if they fell over it.

Everytime I shopped a bike at Bartel's, theirs would always have added "chrome packages" that jerked the price out of sight. They don't use HD accessories either, they use parts plated in Kentucky, I think it's Brown's, but not sure, and they are very proud of that chrome. They claim their chrome is the best anywhere, blah, blah, blah. I think Bartel's profit margins are the best.

Not surprised that you received, "that's normal, but we'll dyno it for $500" from those guys.

Supposedly, the guru of dyno and Power Commanders is the guy at Pomona Valley.
Can't comment on Bartel's and their practice of adding too much chrome for way too much money. But I can tell you this, Brown Plating in KY are the best chromers around. All the custom shops around here use them, and they are about 4hrs from us.
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Old 05-11-2005, 10:21 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Most everyone I know with a RK has that popping when rolling off the throttle. It becomes more pronounced when adding pipes, breather kit or 95" kit and appaerantly is normal for Road Kings!!
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Old 05-11-2005, 11:58 AM   #7 (permalink)
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I just added the Screamin' Eagle stage 1 EFI kit, with some SE slash up slip-on's. The dealer charged me $150 for the stage 1 download, and my bike pops when I let off it...it's not real bad, but it is there.

I haven't ridden a lot of Harley's (maybe 4 or 5 Heritage Classics and Electra Glides) and they all popped too...
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Old 05-11-2005, 01:02 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maxwellpolish
I just added the Screamin' Eagle stage 1 EFI kit, with some SE slash up slip-on's. The dealer charged me $150 for the stage 1 download, and my bike pops when I let off it...it's not real bad, but it is there.

I haven't ridden a lot of Harley's (maybe 4 or 5 Heritage Classics and Electra Glides) and they all popped too...

Popping when you are decelerating is understandable and I could live with that, but we are talking about the bike "popping" as I am accelerating going from 1st to 2nd, 2nd to 3rd. The bike shouldn't be popping as I am accelerating????

Am I confusing all of us??
__________________
Budweiser....The King of Beers.....

Harley-Davidson.......The King of the Road
.

2006 Vivid Black Road Glide
Blacked out:
Front End
Arlen Ness Big Sucker
Wheels
PM Brakes
Wild 1 Handlebars
Lights
Mirrors
Horn
Engine: 95" Dave Mackie (it's a beast!)
It never ends!


Ride Safe
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Old 05-11-2005, 01:24 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Ah, I misunderstood. Yeah, that's a bad thing you have there. I don't see how the dealer could deny that there is an issue...good luck
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Old 05-11-2005, 04:04 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vrod-NYC
Popping when you are decelerating is understandable and I could live with that, but we are talking about the bike "popping" as I am accelerating going from 1st to 2nd, 2nd to 3rd. The bike shouldn't be popping as I am accelerating????

Am I confusing all of us??
It shouldn't be doing either. Just because the dealer has installed these lousy downloads that don't work for the last few years and have stated "they all do that" doesn't mean it is normal. It is only normal for them because their idea of tuning is to drop a generic one size fits all map into every EFI. You are running too lean and need to add some fuel. And if you are popping on ACCEL then you are really lean. Just because your buddies bikes are all doing it doesn't make it right. It just means they all were fed the same load of crap from the dealer.
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Old 05-11-2005, 05:33 PM   #11 (permalink)
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My '99 RKC was having similar problems after installing thundercones. A new tps cured some of it, then a PCII helped some more but kicked my fuel economy down to about 30mpg. I finally put on some TCC true dual headers (ebay for about $215) and ALL popping, accel or decel, went away. I'm actually having to lean out my low and midrange with the PCII now, and it still doesn't pop, backfire, spit, or anything else.

Just because of the true duals? All I know is that the scoot is finally starting to run and react like it's supposed to.
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Old 05-11-2005, 06:46 PM   #12 (permalink)
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When a dealer says"they all do it", what that really means is"we don't know how to fix it"

My bike is an over 10.5 compression 95" motor & it does not pop or backfire at all either on acceleration or deceleration because the fuel is set up correctly(or between gears either for that matter).

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Old 05-12-2005, 12:20 AM   #13 (permalink)
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Question

Are you guys pretty much saying that any type of popping on deceleration is a sign of detonation in the cylinders? I would have hoped that $750 worth of mufflers, intake, and ECM reflash (all genuine Harley) would have been engineered to account for what seems to be a very common problem?

I'm not trying to sound like and old bitch, just new to Harley's and trying to figure things out...

Do most dealers have a race tuner/laptop tuning program where they can richen the mixture a bit to account for any detonation? It would seem silly to have to spend another $250 on the SE Pro EFI Race Fueler for something that should be covered with a factory stage 1 map

Thanks for your help!
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Old 05-12-2005, 12:48 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GRock
It shouldn't be doing either. Just because the dealer has installed these lousy downloads that don't work for the last few years and have stated "they all do that" doesn't mean it is normal. It is only normal for them because their idea of tuning is to drop a generic one size fits all map into every EFI. You are running too lean and need to add some fuel. And if you are popping on ACCEL then you are really lean. Just because your buddies bikes are all doing it doesn't make it right. It just means they all were fed the same load of crap from the dealer.
GRock...

I couldn't have said it better. I am going to speak to the dealer later this week (possibly Friday) and have them take a look at it.

But here's the question....do you think they'll cover it under warranty?? Do I even have a case here since the pipes were aftermarket??
__________________
Budweiser....The King of Beers.....

Harley-Davidson.......The King of the Road
.

2006 Vivid Black Road Glide
Blacked out:
Front End
Arlen Ness Big Sucker
Wheels
PM Brakes
Wild 1 Handlebars
Lights
Mirrors
Horn
Engine: 95" Dave Mackie (it's a beast!)
It never ends!


Ride Safe
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Old 05-12-2005, 01:14 AM   #15 (permalink)
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I think you will be dead in the water with aftermarket pipes, at least when it comes to trying to get this to be a warranty problem. That will be the dealer's out. All of us who put pipes on make it easy for the dealers to throw their hands up in the air and say :finger: "No warranty".

I am putting the HD Race Tuner on my Ultra this weekend to see if I can "improve", as in richen the mixture.

Then, I will continue to ride the bike.
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