New bike - shift shaft question : V-Twin Forum: Harley Davidson Forums

cpmike · 08-23-2008, 08:29 PM

Greetings,
Just bought a 1993 FXRS-SP. Man, she sure is a looker. Lots of black powder coat, custom gauges and signals, black ceramic coated pipes.

I need a little help. Don't have a SM yet. I'll get one asap. The bike has nice forward controls on it. I don't like forwards. I'm short and I like my feet to support me. Looks straight forward changing out the forwards for mids except there is no shifter shaft coming out of the primary. How involved is it to install a shifter shaft? Inner primary has to come off? I sure hope not.

Thx,
Mike

ruger44 · 08-23-2008, 09:43 PM

Very nice bike, inner primary will need to come off if the shaft has been removed. Would be nice if there was a aftermarket shaft that was made in a 2 piece assembly.

Don Camillo · 08-24-2008, 07:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cpmike

Greetings,
Just bought a 1993 FXRS-SP. Man, she sure is a looker. Lots of black powder coat, custom gauges and signals, black ceramic coated pipes.

Great looking bike.Can you post a front picture? I want to buy visor for my FXR but need to see how it will look with this.

cat5752 · 08-24-2008, 09:07 AM

Can you post a picture of the other side, specifically the inspection cover on the primary? Mine has forward controls with a cover over the shaft. Your's just has a flat inspection cover?

cpmike · 08-24-2008, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Camillo

Great looking bike.Can you post a front picture? I want to buy visor for my FXR but need to see how it will look with this.

cpmike · 08-24-2008, 11:06 AM

[quote=cat5752;1419327]Can you post a picture of the other side, specifically the inspection cover on the primary? Mine has forward controls with a cover over the shaft. Your's just has a flat inspection cover?

Yes, just flat inspection cover. Inspection cover is powder coated, too. Looks awesome and someone put a lot of work into it. But it just ain't gonna work for me.

ClassicRider · 08-24-2008, 12:35 PM

Mike~~~ Just bought a 1993 FXRS-SP........
I need a little help. Don't have a SM yet. I'll get one asap. The bike has nice forward controls on it. I don't like forwards. I'm short and I like my feet to support me. Looks straight forward changing out the forwards for mids except there is no shifter shaft coming out of the primary. How involved is it to install a shifter shaft? Inner primary has to come off? I sure hope not.

Mike....

WOW, that's a BEAUTIFUL BIKE.....CONGRATULATIONS.....,,
It appears you have been a member since 2005 but recently purchased the 1993 FXRS-SP Low Rider Sport Edition......you have purchased an awesome bike....I hope it brings you many years of excitement and wonder.....

Getting the "Factory" Service Manual as well as the "Factory" Parts Manual will always go a long way towards helping/assisting you with projects as these.....

"..........How involved is it to install a shifter shaft? Inner primary has to come off? I sure hope not.........."

Any project brings out it's own "involvement" but I wouldn't be too disappointed....I probably would plan on removing the entire outer primary cover....fluids are inexpensive, plus it gives you a chance to see everything.....having the part's manual in front of you will specifically show you the parts you need down to the O~Rings....you can then check out the chain tensioner pad and verify it's ok....and tighten it according to the Service Manual specs as well....it costs you some time, some fluid, and "perhaps" another outer primary gasket....

Here are a couple of "tips" you MIGHT find helpful....if not perhaps someone else might down the road:

1)

Put a thin layer of aviation gasket cement on the inner primary gasket surface, install 4 1/4 " studs made from 3" bolts w/the heads cut off, place the gasket over the studs that are mounted one to each corner, apply a thin layer of aviation gasket cement to the outer primary gasket surface, install the outer primary over the studs. Place a dab of aviation gasket cement on each bolt, begin securing each one until mating surfaces have barely united. Remove each stud individually and replace with appropriate bolt and begin securing each one using a dab of aviation gasket cement to each as well. Then follow the appropriate torquing pattern listed in your FSM.

What the "screws" do above is make it really simple when reinstalling the outer primary....also the "aviation gasket cement is a great "unknown" benefit for keeping things from "weeping" and or eventually "leaking"....it's of course not necessary....however, don't let the "cement" aspect of the name frighten you....it's a very "pliable" material that doesn't really "harden" like "cement"....it really allows surfaces to "seal" nicely together...and with a little "mineral spirits' or "lacquer thinner" is a great substance on a rag to clean up overages easily......below if you are interested you can learn about the product and how and where to use it.....

2)
Here is another link to a thread for another tip about Aviation Gasket Cement, which you might find helpful for your outer primary.....

Click, view, and read:
http://groups.msn.com/HarleyTechTalk...73001162765620

If you wish to follow up I would love to have the "normal sized" photo of the second photo in reply/message #6 above that is a very cool photo....I copy and pasted the one you posted but it's small and if you have a larger one that would be great.....

If you have other any questions please feel free to private message me....

I really believe you will find the modification back to the forward controls not too difficult after acquiring both the FSM and the FPM for the year of your FXR.

UPDATE:

Mike....

I have been "pondering" this a bit further.....if you go up to "reply" or "message" or "response" lol whatever or however you wish to refer to it #4 above, Cat5752 displays a photo of his primary side and while you notice his has a "nub" that protrudes out and your's doesn't....this COULD mean a couple of things....

It could mean the Owner before you took an "aggressive" approach to his forward control modification by actually removing the entire spline out from behind the bike which I believe the previous Owner would have to have done to keep from using the "chrome" or "polished" nub which is used to cover the "protruding "spline" of which you will have to acquire one of those obviously and then since he would have "removed" the "spline" from the back of the inner primary that would mean the previous Owner would have had to put something into the back of the inner primary to keep it from leaking to fill the "hole" left after removing said spline, which would mean you might have to also take off the inner primary to clean this up and make it so it will function again prior to this "modification" or in fact the previous Owner may have replaced the inner primary with an FLH type primary that doesn't feature the spline coming through the outer primary at all....which might mean that you would have to purchase another inner primary to allow for the spline to work with midrange controls....<~~~~this of course would be quite a "aggressive" decision by a previous Owner and I doubt the previous Owner would have taken such a step but I suppose it's possible....Anyway once you take off the outer primary cover or at a minimum remove the outer "inspection cover" (if you simply want a quick look see) it will be "revealed" to you, I am just not certain what would have been done to the "inner" primary to keep it from "leaking" since the spline would have been removed..... The normal procedure for most is to what CAT 5752's bike shows above....a simple chrome or polished cab over the spline.....

Hopefully this makes sense....Keep us posted on your progress.....

I have actually had to remove my inner primary on my 1999 FXR2 a few years ago do to some seals and an O~Ring replacement with the inner primary which meant that I removed the inner primary from the bike and I have photos of this, I would be happy to let you see my photos if interested so that you might see a visual reference to what is going on if this would be helpful, feel free to PM me so we can arrange such if you feel it would be of any benefit.

The reason I bring this all up, I remember when I owned a 2003 Dyna Low Rider and put forward controls on it....with the package for the forward controls was the "nub" or "cap" that Cat5752 is displaying up above and originally I was quite disppointed with the "look" and wanted to modify it to a "smooth" inspection cover "look" like your photo displays....well I was told at the time that to do the "smooth" look was a bit more complicated than simply adding the cover....because of the "spline" involved....at the time....I didn't think much of it....although I always felt I didn't feel the "nub" look was a "clean" look...so I thought I would eventually create the clean look at some later point....but that never happened as I sold the bike before that was ever done....after purchasing my 99' FXR2....and I TOO like the midrange controls for this bike very much....It appears the previous Owner must have felt the same way....now through you I will find out exactly how it was accomplished, whether through simply "plugging" the resulting hole left after the "spline" is removed or whether the previous Owner went to an altogether different Inner Primary.....

Regards,

"Classic"

cpmike · 08-24-2008, 02:51 PM

Thanks for the complements on my bike.

Yes, shaft is gone. My inner primary does have the hole for the shaft. However, the hole is covered (looks like with sheet metal - though I only looked briefly through the inspect cover). Inner primary will have to come off from what I have been told. Really bites that it takes so much work to install the shifter shaft!

I was surprised that I had been a member since '05. I am mostly interested in Sportsters and discuss them on another list. I've always done my own maintenance but never have pulled an inner primary (XL's don't have one).

Mike

ClassicRider · 08-24-2008, 05:40 PM

Mike~~~I was surprised that I had been a member since '05. I am mostly interested in Sportsters and discuss them on another list.

Well given that you have selected what some consider to be one of the best bikes Harley Davidson has ever built perhaps, that "may" change.....time will eventually tell....

As with any bike it will take awhile to get your new FXR the way you want it....but in the end hopefully you will discover it was a great decision.....

Do you care to share why you decided to purchase an FXR to begin with????? It's always interesting to read how people make their choices....

"........Really bites that it takes so much work to install the shifter shaft!....."

Apparently the previous Owner(s) some where along the line determined he/she/they really didn't appreciate that "knob"/"cap" appearance....so indeed it has added some work to return back to the OEM "stock" operation. Depending on what they did to "modify" the situation, hopefully they didn't "weld" or do some sort of other "unrepairable" alteration. You might want to "secure" a source for a new "inner primary" as a back up plan, JUST in case, before you open it up and get too far into returning it back to the OEM set up and discover that it might not be a reversable situation, that way you can still ride until you have all of your parts....something to at least ponder. I have in the past read of people doing various "acts" to cover that "splined" hole with some of them being less favorable to returning it back to the way it was.

Regards,

"Classic"

cat5752 · 08-24-2008, 08:03 PM

Hey, don't make fun of my bike's nub. It's pretty sensitive about it. ;o) My engine looks like a pig compared to yours... That is a very sharp looking bike! Very balanced, if that makes sense. How long are your rear shocks? The bike looks pretty slammed in the rear. The only other thing I would put on it (it would go with the look IMO) is a Rifle front air dam.

Like has already been said, if you want to go back to mid-controls, get a factory manual and a parts manual, some tools and go to it. It isn't as hard as you would think. Oh, and if you are going to buy all the mid-controls, you can let the dealer bend you over the counter, or do some looking around at Elvis' Place. Do a google on it. The parts manual will tell you everything you need to go back to stock, but I'm betting that your 93 isn't that much different than my 85. If you have questions about the procedure, post them on here. I got all the parts to do it, and then decided to keep my forwards. At first they scared the crap out of me, but I really like them now. (except for the nub......?) Good luck whatever you do, and once again -- that is a beautiful bike...
Andy

cpmike · 08-24-2008, 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClassicRider

Well given that you have selected what some consider to be one of the best bikes Harley Davidson has ever built perhaps, that "may" change.....time will eventually tell....

As with any bike it will take awhile to get your new FXR the way you want it....but in the end hopefully you will discover it was a great decision.....

Do you care to share why you decided to purchase an FXR to begin with????? It's always interesting to read how people make their choices....

I looked at every bike from Triumph to Big Dog to Yamaha to Victory to Ducati to BMW and others. Couldn't find anything I liked until finding the FXRS-SP. My criteria was:
#1 bigger than an XL (easier long distance and two up) but not too much over 650 lbs.
#2 bike had to fit me (I like the XL or UJM seating position)
#3 bike had to have attitude (not too civilized)
#4 bike had to handle relatively good, dual disk brakes are a plus
#5 keep it simple (rather not have EFI)

Mike

cpmike · 08-24-2008, 10:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cat5752

...snip... How long are your rear shocks? The bike looks pretty slammed in the rear.

They are 11". A little too short. Rides good but kills the lean angle. I'll probably raise them up later but for now they're good.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cat5752

Like has already been said, if you want to go back to mid-controls, get a factory manual and a parts manual, some tools and go to it. It isn't as hard as you would think. Oh, and if you are going to buy all the mid-controls, you can let the dealer bend you over the counter, or do some looking around at Elvis' Place. Do a google on it. The parts manual will tell you everything you need to go back to stock, but I'm betting that your 93 isn't that much different than my 85. If you have questions about the procedure, post them on here. I got all the parts to do it, and then decided to keep my forwards. At first they scared the crap out of me, but I really like them now. (except for the nub......?) Good luck whatever you do, and once again -- that is a beautiful bike...
Andy

Thanks for the advice. LOL for the nub.

Went to a buddy of mine's house today. He has a TC FXDL with the exact same forward controls. Our bikes are very similar in size. I fit better on his bike. Seems to be that my seat lets me sit back further. Now that I've thought about it more. I think I'm going to try a new seat and/or try and figure out a way to bring the forwards a few inches closer to me. I can always install the shifter shaft later but I'm thinking of that as a last resort. I might even just put the mid pegs on and leave the controls on the forwards. The bike to too damn nice to tear into right now.

Mike

ClassicRider · 08-25-2008, 12:47 AM

"nub" lol well I could of called it a "stub".....lol

The OEM lean angle for the 1993 FXRS-SP Low Rider Sport Edition was 37 degrees for the right and 35 degrees for the left so the "OEM" shock length would have been 13". If you went in that direction you will end up seeing a lot more of that rear tire....which is exactly where much of the debate for the bike was being strongly contested between the "stylists" and the "engineers" back in the day who were wanting the bike to perform in a certain way while others were wanting a "certain" look.......You will be experiencing very little dampening affect with the 11" shocks....so moving to the 12" will most definitely impact the performance and comfort of the bike....there is something to be said for riding a "rigid" however.....lol....the "coolest" looking bikes that HD produces have always been the "slamed' look of the softail and specifically the Fat Boy.....

I agree with you.....just ride the bike and enjoy it....there will be plenty of time for changes if you later decide any are warranted.

I also like the side panels that say FXR as well....and the front fork graphics are not common and stand out very nice....

Out there around Dallas you don't have the canyons to ride like we do here in Colorado....and if you were here there might be a bit more urgency to have the mid range controls at your disposal.....I certainly like them here as they center your body as you enter into the corners....the forward pegs are nice for laid back going down the "highway" type of riding.....thus they have their place as well....

I believe if you were to go to the mid range controls you will enjoy having another location for your feet for long rides as well.....I know I do.

How tall are you?

Regards,

"Classic"

cpmike · 08-25-2008, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ClassicRider

...snip...

The OEM lean angle for the 1993 FXRS-SP Low Rider Sport Edition was 37 degrees for the right and 35 degrees for the left so the "OEM" shock length would have been 13". If you went in that direction you will end up seeing a lot more of that rear tire....which is exactly where much of the debate for the bike was being strongly contested between the "stylists" and the "engineers" back in the day who were wanting the bike to perform in a certain way while others were wanting a "certain" look.......You will be experiencing very little dampening affect with the 11" shocks....so moving to the 12" will most definitely impact the performance and comfort of the bike....there is something to be said for riding a "rigid" however.....lol....the "coolest" looking bikes that HD produces have always been the "slamed' look of the softail and specifically the Fat Boy.....

Yeah, I definitely like the looks of the 11" shocks but I usually lean more towards function in the form vs. function debate.

Quote:

I also like the side panels that say FXR as well....and the front fork graphics are not common and stand out very nice....

Thanks.

Quote:

Out there around Dallas you don't have the canyons to ride like we do here in Colorado....and if you were here there might be a bit more urgency to have the mid range controls at your disposal.....I certainly like them here as they center your body as you enter into the corners....the forward pegs are nice for laid back going down the "highway" type of riding.....thus they have their place as well....

Well put.

Quote:

I believe if you were to go to the mid range controls you will enjoy having another location for your feet for long rides as well.....I know I do.

Might throw the mids on and leave the controls on the forwards.

Quote:

How tall are you?

5'6"

ClassicRider · 08-25-2008, 11:36 AM

The reason I asked about your height is that typically these bikes are the most comfortable for riders from whatever minimum height a person feels they can handle the bike [which is of course different for men and women] up to 5' 11" with an inseam of 33". Thus you are well within the range, so as you said above, finding the right seat as well as getting your feet positioned most comfortable to you will be quite feasible. It also makes sense that you wish to bring the forward controls back a couple of inches.

Anyway you will figure it out.....we always do.......lol

Regards,

"Classic"