Vance & Hines Fuelpak Talk. - Page 4 : V-Twin Forum: Harley Davidson Forums

Jeffytune · 10-12-2007, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hockey-Player

Hi all. Just got my stock motor, '04 Ultra back from one of the best, local, independent shops around here. Had S & S 510G (gear drive) cams put in. Have been using V & H Dresser Duals w/Harley Stage I package (K&N air filter, SE breather, stage I download and SE slash-down slip-ons), and V & H Fuel Pak prior to the cam change. The Fuel Pak was set up with map FP-0389 as recommended by V & H.

With the new 510G cams, V & H recommended FP-1105. Bike has never run better. No more exhaust popping and backfiring. Acceleration and cruise are as smooth as glass. Extremely happy with the result of this change of cams and Fuel Pak map upgrade. Runs much better than prior to this modification. Just wanted to make everyone aware. No dyno runs were performed.

Cheers,
Dave

Good to hear that Dave, I would be curious on the Fuel Mileage.

JPBlueDragon · 10-12-2007, 01:06 PM

Have an '07 Heritage softail with standard HD Stage I (SE slipons, AC, and Stage I MAP). After the Stage I it started getting occasional decel pops, other than that it runs fine. Over the last several thousand miles the decel popping has steadily gotten worse. I'm thinking maybe it's because I had the Stage I done in the winter and the weather warmed up from there? Anyway, I would like to get rid of the popping and get the bike running a little richer therefore cooler. But...I don't want to give up much in the way of gas mileage. What will happen to my mileage is I put the fuelpak on using the recommended MAP for my setup?

Hockey-Player · 10-12-2007, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffytune

Good to hear that Dave, I would be curious on the Fuel Mileage.

Yeah, me too! With just the Stage I kit on the bike, city mileage averaged about 40 and mileage at steady state cruises was up around 50. Going to the Dresser Duals and Fuel Pak, it dropped considerably to around 38 in the city and about 40 on the highway which is considered optimal by V & H. With the 510G cams and the new fuel map, I'm real interested in what it will be. I will say that compared to the way it ran without the new cams, it feels like a rocket sled. Pulls hard at all speeds. Well, not a rocket sled but comparatively. I feel like a kid with a new toy. If I can get some mileage figures before the snow flies, I'll post 'em here.

Cheers,

Dave

Hockey-Player · 10-13-2007, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffytune

Good to hear that Dave, I would be curious on the Fuel Mileage.

Hey Jeffytune, although I'm pleased at how the bike's running with the new cams and the Fuel Pak map (FP-1105), fuel economy has apparently suffered in a big way. The wife and I put on about 125 miles today and burned up 3.8 gallons which averaged out to be slightly below 33 mpg, mostly on the highway. Prior to the cam and map changes, I would have gotten roughly 40 mpg under similar conditions. Admittedly, 125 miles doesn't tell you a lot but it seems pretty obvious that fuel mileage has taken something of a dump. Bike runs well but very cool (based on oil temp) which makes me think that we're running excessively rich. Will check the plugs tomorrow and depending upon what I find, I'm going to give V & H a buzz on Monday and see what they have to say about this.

Cheers,
Dave

Jeffytune · 10-14-2007, 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hockey-Player

Hey Jeffytune, although I'm pleased at how the bike's running with the new cams and the Fuel Pak map (FP-1105), fuel economy has apparently suffered in a big way. The wife and I put on about 125 miles today and burned up 3.8 gallons which averaged out to be slightly below 33 mpg, mostly on the highway. Prior to the cam and map changes, I would have gotten roughly 40 mpg under similar conditions. Admittedly, 125 miles doesn't tell you a lot but it seems pretty obvious that fuel mileage has taken something of a dump. Bike runs well but very cool (based on oil temp) which makes me think that we're running excessively rich. Will check the plugs tomorrow and depending upon what I find, I'm going to give V & H a buzz on Monday and see what they have to say about this.

Cheers,
Dave

Hi Dave.

Checking plugs on a F.I. is not going to tell you a lot, unless it's way out of wack, it is far better to do a dyno run, that will show the fuel curve under load.

Jeffytune · 10-14-2007, 01:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JPBlueDragon

Have an '07 Heritage softail with standard HD Stage I (SE slipons, AC, and Stage I MAP). After the Stage I it started getting occasional decel pops, other than that it runs fine. Over the last several thousand miles the decel popping has steadily gotten worse. I'm thinking maybe it's because I had the Stage I done in the winter and the weather warmed up from there? Anyway, I would like to get rid of the popping and get the bike running a little richer therefore cooler. But...I don't want to give up much in the way of gas mileage. What will happen to my mileage is I put the fuelpak on using the recommended MAP for my setup?

Hi JPB.

Ok, The best time to due a SERT is in the winter, as cold air has more oxygen, that can cause a lean run when cold if you set the curve on a hot day.
But that is not what the stage 1 download is, it is a factory EPA approved fuel curve that may help the bike run right......yours would be the first I know that did.

It's the EPA fault, they want ever tighter standards.

Anywho, yes, the fuel pak can be used to help the curve get dialed in far better.

As too backfiring, a low restriction exhaust will encourage it, mine dose it from time to time, one pop on first to second shift, every ones in a great wile.
On decell, i get the gurgling type sound, but my Pro pipe is a really open pipe, it would be quite difficult to make it totally quite, and perform as well as it does.

With that said, will the Fuelpak help your bike?
Yes, it will help it accelerate better, run smoother and cooler with less backfiring, will it eliminate it completely 100%?
No, but neither will anyone else's, even the Harley SERT warns about that, it's the exhaust design.

It will run better then it does now, and it is worth the investment to put it on.

Hockey-Player · 10-14-2007, 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffytune

Hi Dave.

Checking plugs on a F.I. is not going to tell you a lot, unless it's way out of wack, it is far better to do a dyno run, that will show the fuel curve under load.

Yeah, You're right! Running on the dyno would be the only way of knowing, for sure, what's going on. I'll have to get it done and send V & H the results so that the proper map or adjustments to the current map can be done.

Thanks for your input. I was hoping to avoid the dyno, if I could, but there is no way of getting around it.

Cheers,
Dave

Jeffytune · 10-15-2007, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hockey-Player

Yeah, You're right! Running on the dyno would be the only way of knowing, for sure, what's going on. I'll have to get it done and send V & H the results so that the proper map or adjustments to the current map can be done.

Thanks for your input. I was hoping to avoid the dyno, if I could, but there is no way of getting around it.

Cheers,
Dave

Many shop charge a minimum to do a 2 run fuel test. Paradise Harley (For example) does this to 60 bucks, no adjusting, just a full throttle and roll-on.

If you call around you can find a shop near you to do this for you.

Be sure to ask for temp readings,(Cylinder heads and barrels) V&H likes to have these.

Hockey-Player · 10-15-2007, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffytune

Many shop charge a minimum to do a 2 run fuel test. Paradise Harley (For example) does this to 60 bucks, no adjusting, just a full throttle and roll-on.

If you call around you can find a shop near you to do this for you.

Be sure to ask for temp readings,(Cylinder heads and barrels) V&H likes to have these.

Thanks much for the information. I'm already looking around for a shop to do the dyno runs. Did talk to Adam at V & H today. Ran my setup by him and told him of my fuel mileage concerns. He felt that based upon the cams and the exhaust system I'm currently running and the map that V & H supplied me with, my mileage is right in the ballpark of what it should be. This is based upon what they are obtaining on their test mules at their facility with the same or similar mechanicals. He says that with my setup, Vance & Hines is shooting for an a/f ratio averaging roughly 13.7:1 and based upon what I told him, he feels that it should be right in-line with what they consider to be optimal. That being said, however, there is no way of knowing for sure what the a/f ratios actually are with at least minimal dyno testing. I'll keep looking around until I find a place willing to give me the testing required without trying to steal my wallet or sell me something else that I neither need nor want.

Thanks for all your help!

Cheers,
Dave

hozeheads · 10-17-2007, 04:57 AM

I have just installed my v&h pak in my night train. I only put one mile on the bike but I have noticed A big difference in power and "NO" popping out the exhaust. The only thing that I dont like about the system is after you install it there is really no room under the seat. 10 pounds of crap in a 2 pound bag. I wonder what this will do to the wires in years to come. If they can make a more compact unit this system would be perfect.

Jeffytune · 10-17-2007, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hozeheads

I have just installed my v&h pak in my night train. I only put one mile on the bike but I have noticed A big difference in power and "NO" popping out the exhaust. The only thing that I dont like about the system is after you install it there is really no room under the seat. 10 pounds of crap in a 2 pound bag. I wonder what this will do to the wires in years to come. If they can make a more compact unit this system would be perfect.

I believe they are aware and working on this Issue, But be sure to e-mail V&H with your concerns.

I am only a tech trying to help, I like the V&H products, but I don't work for them.

Semp · 10-17-2007, 02:18 PM

Is it worth the $30 plus shipping to upgrade from ver 11 to ver 12?

Bike is 06 Ultra, V&H basic slipons, SE w/K&N filter, 25 degree injectors, stock ECM, stock motor

Thanks
Semp

Jeffytune · 10-28-2007, 01:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Semp

Is it worth the $30 plus shipping to upgrade from ver 11 to ver 12?

Bike is 06 Ultra, V&H basic slipons, SE w/K&N filter, 25 degree injectors, stock ECM, stock motor

Thanks
Semp

In my humble opinion, yes, it is very much worth it.
The program gain quite a bit better info for run-ability and fine tuning.

Technology always marches forward, and for 30 bucks, you can gain all of that.

Joker1450 · 10-29-2007, 10:39 AM

I'm lookin to buy a 2008 FLHRCI.

Is it possible to install the fuelpak with stock mufflers and K&N air filter?

thank you very much!

I came front FLHT 2002 carburated and I'm very confused.

Jeffytune · 10-29-2007, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joker1450

I'm lookin to buy a 2008 FLHRCI.

Is it possible to install the fuelpak with stock mufflers and K&N air filter?

thank you very much!

I came front FLHT 2002 carburated and I'm very confused.

Hi.

Yes, there is a program for stock engine, high flow air filter with stock unmodified mufflers.
I would used the SE air filter kit, as this is the one V&H used to set the program.

It is fuel program FP-1760.
Link....
http://www.fuelpakfi.com/harley1.html

Be sure the fuelpak is for the 2008, your's has the electric throttle.

I hope this helps.