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[GPO03FatBoy]

Originally Posted by claydbal

you load the base map to start the bike and give the ecm a starting point. it unes from there to an afr that you select. it also tunes optimum timing and decel fuel.

Thanks clay and renegade.

The Zippers unit sounds like it does a nice job of self-tuning a bike based on the user selected AFR map. Given a smart selection of AFR values, this should give a nice smooth ride and definitely improve performance over a bike with a canned map in a stock ECM and untuned VEs.

The closed loop system also sounds great for a guy who constantly rides at different elevations and varying climates, or for someone who doesn't want to have to manually collect data and program his/her self. I guess for me, essentially confined to the east coast, tuning my stock ECM with the Twinscan II+/SERT gives me a manual equivalent for common riding conditions.

I don't see however, how the Zippers unit can optimize timing, without having multi-gas input to see how efficient the burn really is. It would seem that the Zippers unit should be able to do the same thing that the SERT allows for, in terms of reading the max advance possible before knock sets in, and then backing the timing down by some offset level. It's a solid approach, but not one that necessarily peaks performance.

It still seems though, whether using a Twinscan/SERT with the stock ECM, or using the closed loop Zippers system, that the only way to tune for peak HP/TQ is to take the bike to the dyno and figure out the optimal AFR and timing table values. If one wants to tune for peak performance, even with the Zippers unit the bike will still have to find its way to the dyno??

So, unless I'm missing something, even with a closed-loop system, the bike still needs to go to do a dyno for a tune, to find optimal AFR values for peak HP/TQ. With this in mind, I guess what I wonder is, can you take the Zippers out of closed loop mode to do peak performance tuning on a dyno, then, once the optimal AFR and timing settings are determined, put it back into closed loop mode to have the bike self-adjust around the manually entered AFR values?